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eXtreme reverse lens macro with a Quantaray 28mm F/2.8 FD Mount Lens! -> Pics
bear with me this is a book, but should be an interesting read for macro enthusiasts....
I'm not sure how many of you are aware of reverse lens macro photography. I think there are a lot of people that think their 70-300 "macro" lens is "macro", or that they needed to spend thousands on a 65mm and twin light setup to get CRAZY close to an object.
I won't get really deep into it, but by using a wide angle lens stopped down, and mounted on the body backwards you can achieve INSANE levels of zoom with amazing results. As anyone that has tried out macro photography knows, a flash is pretty much neccessary unless you make the sacrifice and live with paper thin DOF.
I first started toying around with this by hand holding my old 17-85mm IS lens on to the body, and took a photo of a mosquitos head. After I sold that lens I played with my 50mm f/1.8mk1, then my 35mm f/2 lens.
![84592241-L-1.jpg](http://photos.tallmanphoto.com/photos/84592241-L-1.jpg)
The problem now was I was holding the lend on the body, which made it super had to control the camera and get things in focus. It was like I needed a third hand. I found an aluminum reverse macro ring adapter for a 52mm threaded lens on ebay for $11 shipped - SCORE! Now I didnt have to hold my 50mm or 35mm lens on.
Next problem, the aperture! These days aperture is all computer controlled and is adjusted on the fly with I think electromagnetic servos. No good for reverse macro, because all that does not work. Solution: Use an old school wide angle lens with manual aperture control and 52mm threads. Enter ebay shopping and a Quantaray 28mm F/2.8 FD mount lens FOR $15 bucks. This thing is NICE... AND ITS 15 BUCKS!! Really you are are looking for any manual aperture lens with 52mm threads... this fit the bill and would result in CRAZY macros.
So why bother with this thing? If you use a modern lens, you have to set the aperture on the camera, then take the lens off the camera with the apertiure closed. I dont know how many of you have tried to manual focus through a f/22 aperture. IT AINT HAPPEN'iN. I look through the lens at f/2.8 and get the sweet spot in the center of where i'm shooting. Using my pinkey finger I push the aperture shut while simultaneously pressing the shutter on the camera. Voila! I suddently went from 5-10% keeper rate to I'd say 80-90% keeper rate. Besides... I don't forsee many people sticking the unprotected rear element of a $200-$1500 lens two inches from a possibly damaging object. If you break it, buy another... its 15 freakin bucks.
So now on to the good stuff... the shots!
My current macro rig consists of my Rebel XTi, 580ex, Jacobs black box, 7" Delta Flip bracket, and the 28mm f/2.8 FD lens. I can still mount my 50mm or 35mm lens on there giving me less zoom, but I have to put the lens on the camera to set the aperture. I will probably get a FD mount 50mm lens in the near future.
![IMG_1108.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_1108.JPG)
![IMG_1109.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_1109.JPG)
![IMG_1110.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_1110.JPG)
Some sample shots. First up something real familiar... a penny. You fill the entire frame with about 1/3 of the penny!!
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6190s.JPG
![IMG_6190.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6190.JPG)
You get about 3/8" out of the full frame here...
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6196s.JPG
![IMG_6196.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6196.JPG)
I also took a few shots to show you why the manual aperture lens is important.
A duracell coppertop AA battery.
f/2.8
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6194s.JPG
![IMG_6194.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6194.JPG)
f/22
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6195s.JPG
![IMG_6195.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6195.JPG)
Buttons on my Motorola V710 cellphone
f/2.8
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6193s.JPG
![IMG_6193.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6193.JPG)
f/22
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6192s.JPG
![IMG_6192.JPG](http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6192.JPG)
Notice the file names... I took these all in a row, first time success on all of them. The flash controls exposure... so there is no fussing around getting it right with manual controls. Just set the damn thing M, ISO 100, 1/200th and you are ready to rock.
Anyways, I just got the lens today so I haven't had any real amounts of time behind it. I'm sure soon enough i'll be posting up some insane crazy photos of some other critter (if I can find any left...here in November).
Costs:
Lens: ~20 shipped
Reverse adapter: 11 shipped
Flash Bracket: 40 shipped
Off-camera cord: 50 bucks
I also posted up a few jumping spider shots I took with my 35mm f/2... set I think on f/11. Those are here: http://photos.tallmanphoto.com/gallery/2038231/1/104593205
I'm not sure how many of you are aware of reverse lens macro photography. I think there are a lot of people that think their 70-300 "macro" lens is "macro", or that they needed to spend thousands on a 65mm and twin light setup to get CRAZY close to an object.
I won't get really deep into it, but by using a wide angle lens stopped down, and mounted on the body backwards you can achieve INSANE levels of zoom with amazing results. As anyone that has tried out macro photography knows, a flash is pretty much neccessary unless you make the sacrifice and live with paper thin DOF.
I first started toying around with this by hand holding my old 17-85mm IS lens on to the body, and took a photo of a mosquitos head. After I sold that lens I played with my 50mm f/1.8mk1, then my 35mm f/2 lens.
![84592241-L-1.jpg](http://photos.tallmanphoto.com/photos/84592241-L-1.jpg)
The problem now was I was holding the lend on the body, which made it super had to control the camera and get things in focus. It was like I needed a third hand. I found an aluminum reverse macro ring adapter for a 52mm threaded lens on ebay for $11 shipped - SCORE! Now I didnt have to hold my 50mm or 35mm lens on.
Next problem, the aperture! These days aperture is all computer controlled and is adjusted on the fly with I think electromagnetic servos. No good for reverse macro, because all that does not work. Solution: Use an old school wide angle lens with manual aperture control and 52mm threads. Enter ebay shopping and a Quantaray 28mm F/2.8 FD mount lens FOR $15 bucks. This thing is NICE... AND ITS 15 BUCKS!! Really you are are looking for any manual aperture lens with 52mm threads... this fit the bill and would result in CRAZY macros.
So why bother with this thing? If you use a modern lens, you have to set the aperture on the camera, then take the lens off the camera with the apertiure closed. I dont know how many of you have tried to manual focus through a f/22 aperture. IT AINT HAPPEN'iN. I look through the lens at f/2.8 and get the sweet spot in the center of where i'm shooting. Using my pinkey finger I push the aperture shut while simultaneously pressing the shutter on the camera. Voila! I suddently went from 5-10% keeper rate to I'd say 80-90% keeper rate. Besides... I don't forsee many people sticking the unprotected rear element of a $200-$1500 lens two inches from a possibly damaging object. If you break it, buy another... its 15 freakin bucks.
So now on to the good stuff... the shots!
My current macro rig consists of my Rebel XTi, 580ex, Jacobs black box, 7" Delta Flip bracket, and the 28mm f/2.8 FD lens. I can still mount my 50mm or 35mm lens on there giving me less zoom, but I have to put the lens on the camera to set the aperture. I will probably get a FD mount 50mm lens in the near future.
Some sample shots. First up something real familiar... a penny. You fill the entire frame with about 1/3 of the penny!!
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6190s.JPG
You get about 3/8" out of the full frame here...
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6196s.JPG
I also took a few shots to show you why the manual aperture lens is important.
A duracell coppertop AA battery.
f/2.8
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6194s.JPG
f/22
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6195s.JPG
Buttons on my Motorola V710 cellphone
f/2.8
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6193s.JPG
f/22
original http://www.jdhaesloop.com/reverse/IMG_6192s.JPG
Notice the file names... I took these all in a row, first time success on all of them. The flash controls exposure... so there is no fussing around getting it right with manual controls. Just set the damn thing M, ISO 100, 1/200th and you are ready to rock.
Anyways, I just got the lens today so I haven't had any real amounts of time behind it. I'm sure soon enough i'll be posting up some insane crazy photos of some other critter (if I can find any left...here in November).
Costs:
Lens: ~20 shipped
Reverse adapter: 11 shipped
Flash Bracket: 40 shipped
Off-camera cord: 50 bucks
I also posted up a few jumping spider shots I took with my 35mm f/2... set I think on f/11. Those are here: http://photos.tallmanphoto.com/gallery/2038231/1/104593205
0
Comments
I love the dialog and story as well as the images. What a saga!
It just makes me want to see more.
Good job,
ziggy53
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
moderator of: The Flea Market [ guidelines ]
Your images are impressive--especially those compound eyes!
PBase Gallery
This is a good way of doing so without spending much money ...
The photos are very impressive.
Good work and idea.
All the best.
My IKEA expresso deak lamp light bulb element (about the size of a flash light bulb)
Skin on my knee (I cropped out a non-hairy part for you folks! HA!)
It is crazy, but your results speak for themselves. Awesome!
I'm mostly interessted in your flash setup. Would you say this is a viable alternative to a dedicated macro flash?
What is thes black box thing?
Thanks!
Thanks I am now blind, having tried this with the same lamp
Good project
Stan
www.ivarborst.nl & smugmug
HAHAH!!! Yeah it took me once to figure this one out. This photo would be impossible without focusing with the aperture at f/22. Its so damn bright its like looking at a light bulb through a magnifying glass! HAHAH! Close the aperture BEFORE looking at the crazy bright object. This is so bright that you'll want to use ISO 100, and 1/4000th, no flash.
As for the other question... only the flash bracket and off shoe cord are dedicated to macro. The 580ex is a very versatile flash, and I use it with a lightsphere to shoot some events indoors. The link to the black box was correct... its my flash battery. I decided instead of playing the AA game, I would just invest $210 in a MONSTER battery and cable and be done with it. Looks and works more professional than AA's. Just simply wear it on your belt or on a shoulder strap... instantly have 800-1000 flash shots.
I have sent you a PM please go view.
VERY cool!
You have definatly peaked mine and (I'm sure) many others interest in this world of reverse lens macro.
Thanks for taking the time to post!
"What a saga!"?
"... innovative work ..."?
"Good ... idea"?
"... definitely one of the coolest things I ever saw"; "... crazy, but ..."?
"... interesting and very cool"?
We've come a long way ... downhill from where amateur photography used to be 15 years ago. Back then virtually every SLR photographer (with the possible exception of the freshest newbies) knew what extension tubes, bellow units, and reverse rings were for. Today's amateurs---grown up with all-automatic cameras and aperture-ring-free AF-D APO EX AD L DC ASPH XR IF VR Di-II IS HSM LD USM G SSM DX ED lenses---believe this ancient technique was a saga, innovative, crazy, and very very cool. The inevitable consequence of progress, I guess.
Incredible.
-- Olaf
P.S. 'sirsloop,' you mustn't set your reversed 28 mm lens to the minimum focusing distance. Leave it set to infinity; then you'll get the same magnification at a longer working distance. Setting a reversed wide-angle lens to the minimum focusing distance (or to the distance between subject and film plane if that happens to be longer than the lens' minimum focusing distance) makes sense only with wide-angle lenses that have Floating Elements (Canon), Floating Focusing (Minolta), Close-Range Correction (Nikon), or whatever the respective manufacturer chose to call it. The cheap Quantaray lens does not have Floating Elements so set it to infinity.
I guess when you are not old enough to know any different... you cant really knock us new guys. Im 25yrs old... only been shooting with a dslr for about a year (50,000+ photos and counting tho!) - live and learn
Honestly, I never got into photography growing up cause I didn't want to dump money into film/prints. Without innovations like modern digital camera's I and a lot of people would not be posting here today.
You're right, great photos can only be interesting if they're taken by salty old guys who had to focus manually under a black wool blanket, after walking to the shoot, uphill, both ways, in a blizzard (that's a joke, by the way).
The tip you offered at the bottom would have been good enough, in fact, I hope you would share more great technical insight like that with all of us on a regular basis. However, amateur, newb, pro, young, old... whatever - sloop's photos are fantastic and your comment comes off as quite condescending.
thanks,
-another dumb kid
moderator of: The Flea Market [ guidelines ]
Your social security is about to run out.
Better take a picture of that last check.
You're absolutely right. I, for example, started photography almost 30 years ago ... and the cost of film, processing, and prints always kept me from doing it right. Especially back when I was a kid, a roll of film was a precious asset to me so I hardly dared to use it up. But you simply cannot use a camera properly when the cost of each single shutter activation is always lurking somewhere in the back of your mind.
In my opinion, getting rid of the cost of film and processing is the most important single impact of the transition from analog to digital on amateur photography (on pro's work, it's getting rid of the delay between firing the shutter and seeing the result). There are so many pointless discussions on the 'net on how digital is, or is not, better than analog, on how many pixels you'd need to outresolve film, on dynamic ranges and grain vs. noise ... but no-one seems to be aware of the aspects that are really important.
On the other hand, to get the most out of digital photography you need a powerful computer, post-processing software, and plenty of mass storage. The cost and the idiosyncrasies of setting up und running a PC still keep many from shooting digital.
Once in a photo store I saw an old granny handing her point-and-shoot to the clerk: 'A print of each shot, and a fresh film, please.' With a perfectly straight face, the clerk took the camera, pulled the memory card, copied the image files onto the store's computer, erased the card, put it back into the camera, and handed it to the customer. 'The prints will be ready the day after tomorrow.'
-- Olaf
At any rate... IT IS COOL no matter when or how you heard about it!
How about the use of bellows? Has anyone used bellows with a reverse lens set-up before? it would work much like an extension tube right?
Thanks!
-James
-James
As for advice when focusing, brace yourself and the camera as good as possible and just practice. You need to adjust your distance to the subject to focus. With a 24mm lens, its only going to be a few inches for working distance. Possibly 2-3"... and the DOF at f/22 will only be 1/8-1/4" deep. Wide open, the DOF will literally be paper thin. Maybe 1/64"
OK I played with my FD 50mm 1.8 after getting my reversing ring. Not too many bugs when it's snowing outside, so a little sugar cookie became my victim.
Thanks for sharing the fun
** Feel free to edit my photos if you see room for improvement.**
Use what talents you possess: the woods would be very silent if
no birds sang there except those that sang best.
~Henry Van Dyke
I'll have to look this back up when I get my new camera. I can play around w/ the lense(s). Good stuff man!
Camera: Nikon D80, 18-55 f3.5 stocker & 18-200 Nikon VR.... with a small collection of filters..
My Smugmug.. STILL Under construction.
http://bayer-Z28.smugmug.com
Can you explain a little more how one sets up the 50mm 1.8...take it off..and turn it around? I got the adapter ring...and here's what I shot so far. I think I'm missing something....flash yes...but that's in the process. I'm also thinking about the FD mount since they go for so cheap on ebay.
Kevin
www.rightangleimages.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mrandrew/318386605/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mrandrew/318437155/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mrandrew/318430162/
All the shots are with my 430ex on camera, with the flash bounced off a stack of white papers to the side or back (or with the match, off the side of my fridge).
Thanks,
Andrew
If you are using an EF lens, you are probalby shooting at f/1.8 still. In order to get the depth of field wider you really need to be shooting AT LEAST f/8 without flash, or right down to f/22 with flash. Before you remove the lens, are you setting the lens to the aperture value you want to shoot at, holding the DOF preview button while similtaneously removing the lens? If you look at my test shots, you will see what a large difference shooting with the aperture closed does for you!