Muench University

[schmoo]

This is your chance to have a one on one critique with master photographer and all-around great guy Marc Muench. We've all seen him active in this forum, been awed at what he can do with his camera, read his publications and we know that he has no fear dishing out honest feedback. To participate in Muench University's course in landscape photography, here's what you do:

1) Choose up to 3 landscape images of your best work. Post-processed, edited, what you consider to be finished, completed and presentable images.

2) Resize to 800 pixels max on the longest size.

3) Email the images to the Smugmug gallery. To do this:

• send an email to dgrin@email.smugmug.com, with the word "muenchiversity" (and ONLY that word!! without quotes) in the subject line. I suggest that you copy/paste "muenchiversity", because without it, your image will not get there.
• Attach your photo to the email.
• In the body of the email write your Dgrin username and the title of your photo.
• More help on email uploading, here.
• You can send up to three images, each in its own email.
• You can check that your image uploaded, and view the other entries HERE.
• You may want to subscribe to the thread so if your image is selected, you'll know about it. (You can set up subscriptions and notification methods in your Dgrin control panel.)

Marc will choose from this gallery an image to critique. If your image does not get chosen, no pouting allowed!

The conversation that will follow is between Marc and the photographer. You are invited to follow along and learn, but it is a dialog, not an open forum. We have a separate thread where you all can chit chat all you want about what's going on with the main critique.

When Marc is done, he will move on to the next image, again at his choosing.

There will be no whining, complaining, or any hand-holding. This is the big time, folks! The rules may be edited to reflect refinement of the critique process. Have fun... and go learn something!


Again, this thread is only for the conversations between Marc and the current photographer he is critiquing. Please DO NOT post here. Any discussion about Muenchiversity should be posted here. We will delete or move any stray posts in this thread.

Our galleries:

• Round One
• Round Two
• Round Three
• Round Four

[Marc Muench]

Crit time

Some of my most fond memories of school at Art Center in Pasadena CA are of the instructor throwing my completed mounted black and white prints on the floor That only occurred when something was not done right, but that was not my fault on the other hand, when I got it right and my piece was held up as an example I thought for a few brief moments that I might actually make it. Crits were a major part of the learning process for photographers, and still are. No they never ended with college, but just occured behind closed doors or worse closed minds However, now we have the internet and forums

Most of us know almost instantly whether we like an image or not. The difficult part is understanding why, so we can repeat. I encourage everyone to get as many opinions as possible. But dont shoot for the opinions of others or photography will become as illusive as chasing rainbows
So not to be confusing to everyone I will critique based on technique first and then inject my subjective opinions. I may not get to everyones images in fact I don't plan on it. That does not mean I don't like you, but rather had nothing to say about the image you presented. If that happens or worse yet I choose your image because it is terrible you MUST NOT take it personal. Just post another one until you get it right or simply cant take it anymore
I have realized over the years that there must be many more folks that are not impressed with my work than those that are, or I would be a billionaire. So I listen, sometimes, and then shoot some more.

Best
Marc Muench

[Marc Muench]

Here we go

anwmn1
White Sands



I don't like the foot prints on the distant dune nore the ones near the FG
The sand is not bright enough
The composition is split into thirds which does work well

I don't see a subject in this composition, so it could be used as a background because of the rather beautiful sky. Since it lacks a subject I do not find it as compelling as it could, given the wonderful mood and location.

What were you thinking

[anwmn1]

Originally Posted by Marc Muench

Here we go


I don't like the foot prints on the distant dune nore the ones near the FG
The sand is not bright enough
The composition is split into thirds which does work well

I don't see a subject in this composition, so it could be used as a background because of the rather beautiful sky. Since it lacks a subject I do not find it as compelling as it could, given the wonderful mood and location.

What were you thinking

Marc-

First of all thanks for choosing one of my photos to start this off.

I agree about the footprints in the sand but did not try to remove them because 1. I am not very good in photoshop and 2. I prefer to leave the scene as it was and not remove or add anything to it. Just my personal view. As far as sand being bright enough- I feel it is acurate to what I saw and fits the mood of the area when I shot it.

To set the scene I was in the National Monument for a few hours in late July. Having never been there I did not know where to go or how far I might need to walk- I was also racing the approaching thunderstorm.

When I shot this the subject in my eyes was the almost bright white curve of the dune near the peak as well as the contrast of the sky vs the dunes. It was also about the feeling and emotion of being there - the vast emptiness of the dunes but yet very peaceful and beautiful sky. The irony or natures balance (depends on view) of a normally very arid area about to be pummeled by a very large thunderstorm.

I feel the major lines of the dunes lead you towards the peak as well as lead you around the rest of the photo without being stuck on one particular area or being led off the frame in any direction.

Thanks again for your view and feel free to disagree with what I have just said. That is the beauty of art- isn't it?

Your thoughts on how to better shoot or edit this shot would also be appreciated- though I may not use it.

Regards-

Aaron

[Marc Muench]

"When I shot this the subject in my eyes was the almost bright white curve of the dune"

I believe you whitnessed some very bright white sand, as I too have been to White Sands and was blinded. In order to share that blinding white light you experienced you will need to alter the luminance in that region of the image. This is not cheating but rather recreating Here is what I would do,

View the density numbers in the info palette of photoshop. The average of the numbers in your file is 160. With black being 0 and white being 255, you have a ways to go before it becomes bright white realative to the sky.

here is what it looks like with the density up around 220. I used the quick selection tool to isolate the dune and then bumped the curve up with a curves adj layer. If you dont understand these moves in photoshop, no worries I really want to illustrate the importance of the relative luminance.



Regarding composition, I think a change of position would solve two issues, providing you could find the correct location in the vicinity. If you moved around to get away from the tracks it would appear more desolate. Also, If you included the distant horizon, for example something 50 miles away, than the VAST would be more obvious to the viewer. I am glad you explained what you felt and viewed when you were there, as I think your image is close but needs these embellishments for others that were not there to feel when viewing your image.

[anwmn1]

Marc-

Thank you- that helps quite a bit and I see the difference.

White Sands is one of those locations on my 'to return to' list hopefully with more time and now I am atleast somewhat familiar with the park. I do have other shots from there with a much further horizon line but they will need some photoshop adjustments as well since they are even darker.

Guess it is time for me to really focus on learning photoshop- which I have been avoiding like the plaque. I'd rather be out shooting than cooped up editing

Thanks again!

Aaron

[Marc Muench]

Originally Posted by anwmn1

Guess it is time for me to really focus on learning photoshop- which I have been avoiding like the plaque. I'd rather be out shooting than cooped up editing

Thanks again!

Aaron

As much as I agree with you about the cooped up feeling, I have found that the time spent learning photoshop or for that matter any post work, as in the old days it was dark room stuff, has paid off exponentially My work if effected in very positive ways by what I learn in post.

Thank you as well for being a good sport as the first to be critiqued

[anwmn1]

Originally Posted by Marc Muench

As much as I agree with you about the cooped up feeling, I have found that the time spent learning photoshop or for that matter any post work, as in the old days it was dark room stuff, has paid off exponentially My work if effected in very positive ways by what I learn in post.

Thank you as well for being a good sport as the first to be critiqued

I know you are right and thanks for telling me

See you in Moab!


On to the next picture-

[Marc Muench]

Tessa HD
Misty Morning



This image has been exposed and processed perfectly
I would not change anything

This breaks some of the rules in post though by not having a black point or a white point it lacks the full range possible and thus contrast. However, there is enough well composed subject matter that becomes more intriguing with the fog and low contrast.

I do think something else in the image would have set it off. Obviously an animal would have worked providing you were lucky enough, but it could have been anything. Still, this is such a beautifully composed image that it holds my interest as is, making it a step above the normal foggy forest scene.

What were you thinking

[Tessa HD]

Marc,

Thank you for critiquing my photo!

I covet many of the 'broad' landscapes that people have taken from beautiful places around the world. With this photo I had actually been on a mission that morning to find a broad view of our local area. I live in an area of rolling hills, lush with trees and vegetation. I had driven to the end of a dirt road up a fairly steep hill in search of an overlook to find an eye appealing 'broad' view of the valley. As usual, I just couldn't find a broad view that grabbed me, but this narrower scene did.

What drew me first was the feeling, jungle-like. As I scoped it out I found a natural composition with nice depth, starting with the overgrown, dewy brush in the foreground to the overlapping trees that gradually descended down the other side of the hill. One of my neighbors romantically calls our fog "mist". And, of course, without the mist, this would not have been interesting. Also I felt the brush and trees framed in the scene, yet the darker foreground leading to the bright light in the background provides an exit from the wilderness.

I must confess, shame on me, I did not have a tripod, so shooting two exposures was out of the question. I set my exposure based on the lighting in the middle-upper part of the trees, hoping the foreground could retain some detail. As you pointed out, there really wasn't a white and black point, so the conditions were in my favor to keep the foreground from being too underexposed. I used the dodge tool on selective areas in the foreground to brighten it, bring out some detail, and help with the depth. Overcast misty days also give a bluish cast, so I had to compensate for that which helped warm up the scene.

There ARE lots of deer around here, but I just couldn't get any to cooperate with me that morning.

Thank you again for critiquing my photo! I have much to learn about landscape photography, (my landscape portfolio is quite small!) and I am eagerly awaiting your additional critiques on the other submissions!