Hi, we don't pre announce dates, I'm sorry. It's all front-burner though Thanks for your patience!
SmugMug has such great customer service overall...but I have to say this non-customer-friendly policy seems out of kilter with the "goodness" of SmugMug's other customer service policies. It's a "non-answer" answer at best.
Just this morning Boeing announced that it's rolling out it's first 787 on July, 8. Hearing this made me chuckle when I read the SmugMug post about not pre-announcing dates. I could be wrong, but I suspect Boeing's new 787 is at least as complex as SmugMug's product.
I don't really think ANYONE has requested a date-specific commitment from SmugMug...a realistic "expectation", "target date", or "ball-park WAG' would suffice, I'm sure.
SmugMug has such great customer service overall...but I have to say this non-customer-friendly policy seems out of kilter with the "goodness" of SmugMug's other customer service policies. It's a "non-answer" answer at best.
Just this morning Boeing announced that it's rolling out it's first 787 on July, 8. Hearing this made me chuckle when I read the SmugMug post about not pre-announcing dates. I could be wrong, but I suspect Boeing's new 787 is at least as complex as SmugMug's product.
I don't really think ANYONE has requested a date-specific commitment from SmugMug...a realistic "expectation", "target date", or "ball-park WAG' would suffice, I'm sure.
Hi Papajay, Ouch - I'm sorry we're falling short for you on this. We won't give a date, it'll be ready when it's ready I wish I had a better answer for you on that.
We are working hard at it and being extremely transparent about the entire process, including updating all of you on how the whole thing is shaping up. If that's customer un-friendly, then I don't really know what else to say
Hi Papajay, Ouch - I'm sorry we're falling short for you on this. We won't give a date, it'll be ready when it's ready I wish I had a better answer for you on that.
We are working hard at it and being extremely transparent about the entire process, including updating all of you on how the whole thing is shaping up. If that's customer un-friendly, then I don't really know what else to say
SmugMug is a business, and like most businesses I'm guessing there is a periodic (daily??, weekly??, bi-weekly??, monthly??) meeting of the key personnel to discuss the status of projects, etc. If Chris or Don asked the development team to estimate how long a project will take to complete, I'm sure an answer like "It'll be ready when it's ready" wouldn't set too well, and rightly so...successfully operating a business requires continually refining the operating plan based on the lastest "knowns" and making best-guesses about the "unknowns".
I don't think you are giving customers enough credit for understanding that "things take time", and "Rome wasn't built in a day" (as Mike Lane pointed out in an earlier post). My point is I believe there's less harm in sharing a completion estimate (even if it turns out to be wrong), than appearing to be non-committal, eg does "front burner" mean a week, a month, 6 months, a year?? I just think this ONE policy (not "estimating" time frames) sucks from a customer service perspective, that's all, and I was beginning to think that Don, at least, was inclined to agree.
I just think this ONE policy (not "estimating" time frames) sucks from a customer service perspective, that's all, and I was beginning to think that Don, at least, was inclined to agree.
I'm sorry that you feel it sucks, Papajay. We are doing our best here, to keep all of you in the loop, letting you know exactly how this thing is playing out. We don't have a date, and won't make an estimate, I'm sorry.
How many companies are as transparent as we, letting you all in on this? We love it, we feel it's incredibly valuable input, and we hold your input dear. In fact, it's critical to our success. We won't give you a date - only to have it be missed, perhaps by something beyond our control - because that would suck even more, IMO.
Again, I'm terribly sorry we aren't measuring up in your eyes here. We'll continue to press on, and hopefully the SmugSorcerers will have something for us soon on this
I'm sorry that you feel it sucks, Papajay. We are doing our best here, to keep all of you in the loop, letting you know exactly how this thing is playing out. We don't have a date, and won't make an estimate, I'm sorry.
How many companies are as transparent as we, letting you all in on this? We love it, we feel it's incredibly valuable input, and we hold your input dear. In fact, it's critical to our success. We won't give you a date - only to have it be missed, perhaps by something beyond our control - because that would suck even more, IMO.
Again, I'm terribly sorry we aren't measuring up in your eyes here. We'll continue to press on, and hopefully the SmugSorcerers will have something for us soon on this
All the best to you, Papajay!
The point he is trying to make and I'm trying to make is this.
It will be done when it's done, just doesnt tell the customer anything at all.
It makes us fell like you don't care about us and someday, maybe we will do this change.
The correct reply should have been:
we are currently still working the issue. Our testing is going _____ (You fill in the blank). We have or have not gotten the server/storage problem resolved. etc. You can give us information with out quoting a date.
Give us information that tells us something.
The we don't quote dates or it will be ready when it ready tells us zip, zero zilch. It gives us the impression that you don't care enough about this issue to even make a valid response to the question.
I think we've been doing that? I don't really have much to add to Baldy's prior posts in this thread, and that it's absolutely a priority thing for us all at SmugMug. But in the interest of trying to shed more light on things...
I'm sorry we don't have a better, more detailed answer for you right now. I'm really sorry that you feel we don't care - quite the opposite, and we have a 5 year record of proving that. Thanks to you, and everyone, for your continued patience in this.
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
edited April 13, 2007
It's the top thing Don is working on and most of us at SmugMug have come to believe that it may be more important to more people than we knew. We'd love to go live with it tonight (it's testing night) but we're not out of the hardware performance hell that has been our home lately.
The good news is we've solved server performance, which Don blogged about yesterday:
It has come down to storage. The short story is the Sun storage we bought doesn't meet our performance needs. The Rackable storage we bought doesn't meet our reliability needs.
We do have storage in house that seems to be reliable and fast enough, but we need more of it and more testing time before we're ready to pull the trigger and go live.
I was tempted to begin the next sentence with, "If we're lucky..." But the Rackable and Sun disappointments set us back weeks so I can only give an honest answer: it depends on how Dell and HP fare on the tests we're doing now and how quickly they can get us hardware once we choose a vendor. I'd love nothing more than for it to be week(s) but we didn't see these hardware issues coming last time...
It's the top thing Don is working on and most of us at SmugMug have come to believe that it may be more important to more people than we knew. .....
.....I'd love nothing more than for it to be week(s) but we didn't see these hardware issues coming last time...
Thanks, Baldy, once again, for putting some "meat on the bones" regarding the status of this project. With THIS answer, I'm satisfied, finally, that it is indeed getting top-level commitment, and will ultimately be successful.
Sorry if I sound like a broken record to some folks on the topic of being kept in the loop...your posts, of late, have been helpful because you've kept them basic and honest, and you have not gotten defensive.
I'm confident I will remain a loyal SmugMug customer.
The point he is trying to make and I'm trying to make is this. It will be done when it's done, just doesnt tell the customer anything at all. It makes us fell like you don't care about us and someday, maybe we will do this change.
I think you, and a few other people in this thread, are being unfair to the Smugmug guys. If they say they're working on it - that it's on the "to do" list - then that's enough for me, and it should be enough for you.
Hard, fixed dates aren't something anyone with any experience in the tech industry gives out - because there's always something that goes wrong, needs more testing, requires extra time. And we all know that most people tend to whine and complain when something doesn't happen when they thought it would - if the Smugmug crew gives out a date, and they miss it, having to apologize to everyone and give reasons why puts them in a hard position. Who wants to waste time and energy on that?
I'm quite sure that's why their policy now is to not give out dates - that's just the smart way to run a technology business. It's not like they're making spark plugs and they know exactly when the 100,000th product is going to roll off the line. Software development is more complex than that.
Do I want the features everything is asking for? Yes, absolutely - I don't particularly like that Google and other search engines can deep-index my content...my preference would be for someone to find it when they visit my photo site. But I'm not going to hold anyone at Smugmug hostage for a date - I'll just hope it's coming soon.
I think you, and a few other people in this thread, are being unfair to the Smugmug guys. If they say they're working on it - that it's on the "to do" list - then that's enough for me, and it should be enough for you.
Hard, fixed dates aren't something anyone with any experience in the tech industry gives out - because there's always something that goes wrong, needs more testing, requires extra time. And we all know that most people tend to whine and complain when something doesn't happen when they thought it would - if the Smugmug crew gives out a date, and they miss it, having to apologize to everyone and give reasons why puts them in a hard position. Who wants to waste time and energy on that?
I'm quite sure that's why their policy now is to not give out dates - that's just the smart way to run a technology business. It's not like they're making spark plugs and they know exactly when the 100,000th product is going to roll off the line. Software development is more complex than that.
Do I want the features everything is asking for? Yes, absolutely - I don't particularly like that Google and other search engines can deep-index my content...my preference would be for someone to find it when they visit my photo site. But I'm not going to hold anyone at Smugmug hostage for a date - I'll just hope it's coming soon.
Wow, I just stumbled on this tread (while in search for an answer to why I cannot simultaneously have a private site, but not also have keywords and favorite photos as tools within my private site) and can't help but not chime in and get a little defensive. I've got to agree with Jason, who made a post in response to papajay's comment below...some of y'all (in this case, papajay, et al) need to just chill out and send a little appreciation Smugmug's way. I for one, am confident that the folks at Smugmug are doing the best they can and I have been quite satisfied by Smugmug and the customer service. Yes, I've seen the many "we'll get it done" notices, and have wished that I could know the exact date when such things will happen, but I trust that in due time, I'll get done. That's not poor customer service...that's just reality. And if Smugmug chooses to provide the "we'll get it done as soon as we can" explanation, frankly, that's their preogative. In the meantime, making a tirade in demand of information (and you know what, the fact that the guys at Smugmug gives information does not mean that you're entitled to it) and then making conclusory statements about the company's business sense...well, it's a little unfair and a lot lame. (Unless you're a believer in the "the squeeky wheel gets the oil" philosophy).
However, if you're convinced that the folks at Smugmug are lying to you (and that they are not in fact doing the best the can), then fire away. But, after your string of charged comments of "I want a date" and "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date" and "Boeing gives dates so should you" etc., etc., etc., you then were suddently "satisfied" with Baldy providing "some meat." Thing is, you still don't know when things will finally be put out. And the other thing...the folks at Smugmug will be working at improving the site at the same pace and quality as before Baldy provided whatever additional information he did. Andy's explanation that what's being done is being done as soon as possible is still true.
Thanks, Baldy, once again, for putting some "meat on the bones" regarding the status of this project. With THIS answer, I'm satisfied, finally, that it is indeed getting top-level commitment, and will ultimately be successful.
Sorry if I sound like a broken record to some folks on the topic of being kept in the loop...your posts, of late, have been helpful because you've kept them basic and honest, and you have not gotten defensive.
I'm confident I will remain a loyal SmugMug customer.
Wow, I just stumbled on this tread (while in search for an answer to why I cannot simultaneously have a private site, but not also have keywords and favorite photos as tools within my private site) and can't help but not chime in and get a little defensive. I've got to agree with Jason, who made a post in response to papajay's comment below...some of y'all (in this case, papajay, et al) need to just chill out and send a little appreciation Smugmug's way. I for one, am confident that the folks at Smugmug are doing the best they can and I have been quite satisfied by Smugmug and the customer service. Yes, I've seen the many "we'll get it done" notices, and have wished that I could know the exact date when such things will happen, but I trust that in due time, I'll get done. That's not poor customer service...that's just reality. And if Smugmug chooses to provide the "we'll get it done as soon as we can" explanation, frankly, that's their preogative. In the meantime, making a tirade in demand of information (and you know what, the fact that the guys at Smugmug gives information does not mean that you're entitled to it) and then making conclusory statements about the company's business sense...well, it's a little unfair and a lot lame. (Unless you're a believer in the "the squeeky wheel gets the oil" philosophy).
However, if you're convinced that the folks at Smugmug are lying to you (and that they are not in fact doing the best the can), then fire away. But, after your string of charged comments of "I want a date" and "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date" and "Boeing gives dates so should you" etc., etc., etc., you then were suddently "satisfied" with Baldy providing "some meat." Thing is, you still don't know when things will finally be put out. And the other thing...the folks at Smugmug will be working at improving the site at the same pace and quality as before Baldy provided whatever additional information he did. Andy's explanation that what's being done is being done as soon as possible is still true.
Well done...(as tirades go, anyway)! Like anyone else, you are entitled to your own opinon...but tossing insults with statements using quotation marks for things that were never said [eg "I want a date"...never said that; "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date"....never said that; "Boeing gives dates so should you"...implied, arguably, but did not say that, either...and NEVER once suggested "the folks at Smugmug are lying" (quoting you, this time)] is, well...just "a little unfair and a lot lame".
0
Options
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
Wow :wow Jason off topic here but man have you got a beautiful site!
Wow, no kidding.
Jason, we really appreciate the understanding. I can understand the consternation, though, because this thread has gone on a long time... And honestly, my attitude at the beginning of this project was "this is gonna be expensive and hard and only appealing to a small percentage of our customers."
It also bugged me that sites like Flickr were gonna stay focused on features that had broader appeal while we slaved in obscurity on this.
But we have more self-interest in this than we did in the beginning because we've come to believe it's more broadly appealing than we understood. So even if the pioneers of this thread gave up on us, we'd still be excited about finishing these features.
It is hard and expensive, though, at least with the way our systems are designed.
Well done...(as tirades go, anyway)! Like anyone else, you are entitled to your own opinon...but tossing insults with statements using quotation marks for things that were never said [eg "I want a date"...never said that; "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date"....never said that; "Boeing gives dates so should you"...implied, arguably, but did not say that, either...and NEVER once suggested "the folks at Smugmug are lying" (quoting you, this time)] is, well...just "a little unfair and a lot lame".
It also bugged me that sites like Flickr were gonna stay focused on features that had broader appeal while we slaved in obscurity on this.
Don't think you're alone on this. Flickr have recently done a thing where your identity is rated for possible racy-ness. If you do things like nudes or anything else potentialy offensive (to some, artistic to others), your sites are not accessible to others who don't want to deal with that type of content. Don't yet understand HOW, but there you are. SmugMug has avoided this altogether by not allowing such photos but clearly other sites are having to pay attention to levels of protection and privacy.
I know this one has been alive for storage but I was wondering if any consideration had been given to the top tier storage fokls (EMC, IBM, Hitachi, etc)?
Beyond that, how go the tests with the other storage platforms? And, on the note of the testing hte functionality, did the testing go well? Is it all ready to roll pending the storage performance? Or is the coding still going on? (Just curious..)
First, I'm a SM beginner. I've read many of the pages of this thread and I'm trying to find a way to have SM fit the following needs (probably not available yet...)
We will have private galleries that contain images that are named by a file name that is numbers only (eg 20064022, 20076011) and these file names are essential to our other data systems. We also have caption and keyword information loaded with the images. I am assuming the proposed 'option 2' would allow searching our site by the people we invite to the site. The invitees need to be able to find individual images and download them in the original size. (However, will they be able to search by the filename number?)
Are there intermediate solutions? For example, could I make galleries public, watermark the images, and restrict downloading (of originals) to only invitees or password access? Two key needs 1) to restrict access to download images to a defined, limited, private group and 2) search for specific images in a set of galleries. Is there a way to set download restrictions that would do this?
Other possiblities?
Thanks
Ted
0
Options
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
I know this one has been alive for storage but I was wondering if any consideration had been given to the top tier storage fokls (EMC, IBM, Hitachi, etc)?
Beyond that, how go the tests with the other storage platforms? And, on the note of the testing hte functionality, did the testing go well? Is it all ready to roll pending the storage performance? Or is the coding still going on? (Just curious..)
So the update is we've settled on the Dell MD3000s. We can get them quickly, they're reliable, fast enough, and priced very well. We have two of them in production and several more in the racks copying data from other arrays but not ready to go live.
Our otther tests were limited to Rackable (not reliable but fast and cheap), Sun (reliable but slow and expensive) and HP (not sure what the conclusion was but it took us a long time to get them).
The current status is we haven't been working on the code for a long time because we think we completed that, but we're still configuring Dell arrays, copying data, returning the test arrays from other vendors, and telliing the fire marshall that it's okay—the unharnesed wiring is temporary and limited to the test arrays.
The Dells have a firmware bug that they've acknowledged but haven't given a date to fix. My understanding is we can go live even with the bug, it will just torment us with false alerts.
These hardware/scaling-related delays are a major pain because we have at least one other very significant feature that is held up for this.
I am assuming the proposed 'option 2' would allow searching our site by the people we invite to the site. The invitees need to be able to find individual images and download them in the original size. (However, will they be able to search by the filename number?)
Are there intermediate solutions? For example, could I make galleries public, watermark the images, and restrict downloading (of originals) to only invitees or password access? Two key needs 1) to restrict access to download images to a defined, limited, private group and 2) search for specific images in a set of galleries. Is there a way to set download restrictions that would do this?
Other possiblities?
Thanks
Ted
Hi Ted and welcome!
Hmmmm, this is an interesting challenge. If you mark an album private or password-protected, you as the site owner will be able to search but your visitors won't. I'm sorry about that.
But in a way, your entire site will be private when you exercise option 2. It won't be discoverable via Google or Yahoo or via SmugMug's search. But once there, your visitors will be able to search for images in any gallery or category, because search is context-aware.
Update: Bad news first. The new Sun servers are performing but the data storage arrays we bought from them aren't, so we spent the entire week working with Sun trying to understand why. Neither we nor Sun's top geeks yet understand why we see performance bottlenecks with the disks.
If we can't get the Sun arrays to perform, we have to find other arrays that can, get them in the racks and resume testing. That's a weeks not days delay. :cry
Good news: testing is going well so we get to see these features in action on our private test servers. We just can't release them into production until performance bottlenecks are solved.
Also, we hope to take this opportunity to add some badly-needed search enhancements. Film at 11.
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
edited May 11, 2007
Okay, hold your breath. In 30-60 minutes or so we're taking the site down to install the new hardware this feature requires.
I know you'd love to beta test but we feel we have to run with this hardware in production for a week first to make sure all is stable. If any performance demands from SearchIslands spill over to other functionality, we'll get lynched by the mob.
Any update on this? I opened a trial account with SmugMug, and when my friends complained that my photos of them drinking & partying were showing up when googling their names, I had to mark all my albums private.
Since I lost all the cool SmugMug functionality, I never converted to a paid account. Once this is up and running, I will be signing up for sure!
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
edited May 23, 2007
Crunch time. :whew
It's 1:00 a.m. Tuesday night/Wednesday morning and we're testing until our eyes bleed. This is a very complex feature under the covers... The hope is to bring the site down Thursday night and go live Friday morning.
Then we'll need all eyes on it Friday morning to see if our testing caught everything. We're hoping for a quiet launch and to monitor the site through the Monday holiday before making much noise about this.
It's 1:00 a.m. Tuesday night/Wednesday morning and we're testing until our eyes bleed. This is a very complex feature under the covers... The hope is to bring the site down Thursday night and go live Friday morning.
Then we'll need all eyes on it Friday morning to see if our testing caught everything. We're hoping for a quiet launch and to monitor the site through the Monday holiday before making much noise about this.
Thanks Baldy....this is great news! I can hardly wait to see what the Smugmug team has come up with, and look forward to exploring the new functionality this weekend.
Thanks Baldy....this is great news! I can hardly wait to see what the Smugmug team has come up with, and look forward to exploring the new functionality this weekend.
Great timing for me as I just bought an account for my niece with a young family. I know the features will be more imortant for her than myself, so I will check it out. Kudos to the Smugmug heroes for all their hard work and dedication to service for the little guys as well as the pros.
Comments
I wont hold my breath as this issue has been on going for over two years now with no visible results.
SmugMug has such great customer service overall...but I have to say this non-customer-friendly policy seems out of kilter with the "goodness" of SmugMug's other customer service policies. It's a "non-answer" answer at best.
Just this morning Boeing announced that it's rolling out it's first 787 on July, 8. Hearing this made me chuckle when I read the SmugMug post about not pre-announcing dates. I could be wrong, but I suspect Boeing's new 787 is at least as complex as SmugMug's product.
I don't really think ANYONE has requested a date-specific commitment from SmugMug...a realistic "expectation", "target date", or "ball-park WAG' would suffice, I'm sure.
We are working hard at it and being extremely transparent about the entire process, including updating all of you on how the whole thing is shaping up. If that's customer un-friendly, then I don't really know what else to say
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
SmugMug is a business, and like most businesses I'm guessing there is a periodic (daily??, weekly??, bi-weekly??, monthly??) meeting of the key personnel to discuss the status of projects, etc. If Chris or Don asked the development team to estimate how long a project will take to complete, I'm sure an answer like "It'll be ready when it's ready" wouldn't set too well, and rightly so...successfully operating a business requires continually refining the operating plan based on the lastest "knowns" and making best-guesses about the "unknowns".
I don't think you are giving customers enough credit for understanding that "things take time", and "Rome wasn't built in a day" (as Mike Lane pointed out in an earlier post). My point is I believe there's less harm in sharing a completion estimate (even if it turns out to be wrong), than appearing to be non-committal, eg does "front burner" mean a week, a month, 6 months, a year?? I just think this ONE policy (not "estimating" time frames) sucks from a customer service perspective, that's all, and I was beginning to think that Don, at least, was inclined to agree.
He's said that time and again
I'm sorry that you feel it sucks, Papajay. We are doing our best here, to keep all of you in the loop, letting you know exactly how this thing is playing out. We don't have a date, and won't make an estimate, I'm sorry.
How many companies are as transparent as we, letting you all in on this? We love it, we feel it's incredibly valuable input, and we hold your input dear. In fact, it's critical to our success. We won't give you a date - only to have it be missed, perhaps by something beyond our control - because that would suck even more, IMO.
Again, I'm terribly sorry we aren't measuring up in your eyes here. We'll continue to press on, and hopefully the SmugSorcerers will have something for us soon on this
All the best to you, Papajay!
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
It will be done when it's done, just doesnt tell the customer anything at all.
It makes us fell like you don't care about us and someday, maybe we will do this change.
The correct reply should have been:
we are currently still working the issue. Our testing is going _____ (You fill in the blank). We have or have not gotten the server/storage problem resolved. etc. You can give us information with out quoting a date.
Give us information that tells us something.
The we don't quote dates or it will be ready when it ready tells us zip, zero zilch. It gives us the impression that you don't care enough about this issue to even make a valid response to the question.
I think we've been doing that? I don't really have much to add to Baldy's prior posts in this thread, and that it's absolutely a priority thing for us all at SmugMug. But in the interest of trying to shed more light on things...
There were some unexpected things found during development:
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=502076&postcount=217
There have been some hardware things to work out:
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=505469&postcount=224
http://blogs.smugmug.com/don/2007/04/11/sun-honeymoon-update-servers/
We have begun testing it internally and have shared a ton of info about this unreleased feature:
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=501576&postcount=210
I'm sorry we don't have a better, more detailed answer for you right now. I'm really sorry that you feel we don't care - quite the opposite, and we have a 5 year record of proving that. Thanks to you, and everyone, for your continued patience in this.
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
The good news is we've solved server performance, which Don blogged about yesterday:
http://blogs.smugmug.com/don/2007/04/11/sun-honeymoon-update-servers/
It has come down to storage. The short story is the Sun storage we bought doesn't meet our performance needs. The Rackable storage we bought doesn't meet our reliability needs.
We do have storage in house that seems to be reliable and fast enough, but we need more of it and more testing time before we're ready to pull the trigger and go live.
I was tempted to begin the next sentence with, "If we're lucky..." But the Rackable and Sun disappointments set us back weeks so I can only give an honest answer: it depends on how Dell and HP fare on the tests we're doing now and how quickly they can get us hardware once we choose a vendor. I'd love nothing more than for it to be week(s) but we didn't see these hardware issues coming last time...
Thanks, Baldy, once again, for putting some "meat on the bones" regarding the status of this project. With THIS answer, I'm satisfied, finally, that it is indeed getting top-level commitment, and will ultimately be successful.
Sorry if I sound like a broken record to some folks on the topic of being kept in the loop...your posts, of late, have been helpful because you've kept them basic and honest, and you have not gotten defensive.
I'm confident I will remain a loyal SmugMug customer.
I think you, and a few other people in this thread, are being unfair to the Smugmug guys. If they say they're working on it - that it's on the "to do" list - then that's enough for me, and it should be enough for you.
Hard, fixed dates aren't something anyone with any experience in the tech industry gives out - because there's always something that goes wrong, needs more testing, requires extra time. And we all know that most people tend to whine and complain when something doesn't happen when they thought it would - if the Smugmug crew gives out a date, and they miss it, having to apologize to everyone and give reasons why puts them in a hard position. Who wants to waste time and energy on that?
I'm quite sure that's why their policy now is to not give out dates - that's just the smart way to run a technology business. It's not like they're making spark plugs and they know exactly when the 100,000th product is going to roll off the line. Software development is more complex than that.
Do I want the features everything is asking for? Yes, absolutely - I don't particularly like that Google and other search engines can deep-index my content...my preference would be for someone to find it when they visit my photo site. But I'm not going to hold anyone at Smugmug hostage for a date - I'll just hope it's coming soon.
Jason Dunn
http://photos.jasondunn.com
The Photos: photos.jasondunn.com
The Blog: www.jasondunn.com
EDIT: In fact I liked it so much I added it to the Smugmug Showcase!
http://photos.mikelanestudios.com/
However, if you're convinced that the folks at Smugmug are lying to you (and that they are not in fact doing the best the can), then fire away. But, after your string of charged comments of "I want a date" and "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date" and "Boeing gives dates so should you" etc., etc., etc., you then were suddently "satisfied" with Baldy providing "some meat." Thing is, you still don't know when things will finally be put out. And the other thing...the folks at Smugmug will be working at improving the site at the same pace and quality as before Baldy provided whatever additional information he did. Andy's explanation that what's being done is being done as soon as possible is still true.
Well done...(as tirades go, anyway)! Like anyone else, you are entitled to your own opinon...but tossing insults with statements using quotation marks for things that were never said [eg "I want a date"...never said that; "if they want to run a good busines they better tell me date"....never said that; "Boeing gives dates so should you"...implied, arguably, but did not say that, either...and NEVER once suggested "the folks at Smugmug are lying" (quoting you, this time)] is, well...just "a little unfair and a lot lame".
Jason, we really appreciate the understanding.
It also bugged me that sites like Flickr were gonna stay focused on features that had broader appeal while we slaved in obscurity on this.
But we have more self-interest in this than we did in the beginning because we've come to believe it's more broadly appealing than we understood. So even if the pioneers of this thread gave up on us, we'd still be excited about finishing these features.
It is hard and expensive, though, at least with the way our systems are designed.
Don't think you're alone on this. Flickr have recently done a thing where your identity is rated for possible racy-ness. If you do things like nudes or anything else potentialy offensive (to some, artistic to others), your sites are not accessible to others who don't want to deal with that type of content. Don't yet understand HOW, but there you are. SmugMug has avoided this altogether by not allowing such photos but clearly other sites are having to pay attention to levels of protection and privacy.
Beyond that, how go the tests with the other storage platforms? And, on the note of the testing hte functionality, did the testing go well? Is it all ready to roll pending the storage performance? Or is the coding still going on? (Just curious..)
We will have private galleries that contain images that are named by a file name that is numbers only (eg 20064022, 20076011) and these file names are essential to our other data systems. We also have caption and keyword information loaded with the images. I am assuming the proposed 'option 2' would allow searching our site by the people we invite to the site. The invitees need to be able to find individual images and download them in the original size. (However, will they be able to search by the filename number?)
Are there intermediate solutions? For example, could I make galleries public, watermark the images, and restrict downloading (of originals) to only invitees or password access? Two key needs 1) to restrict access to download images to a defined, limited, private group and 2) search for specific images in a set of galleries. Is there a way to set download restrictions that would do this?
Other possiblities?
Thanks
Ted
Our otther tests were limited to Rackable (not reliable but fast and cheap), Sun (reliable but slow and expensive) and HP (not sure what the conclusion was but it took us a long time to get them).
The current status is we haven't been working on the code for a long time because we think we completed that, but we're still configuring Dell arrays, copying data, returning the test arrays from other vendors, and telliing the fire marshall that it's okay—the unharnesed wiring is temporary and limited to the test arrays.
The Dells have a firmware bug that they've acknowledged but haven't given a date to fix. My understanding is we can go live even with the bug, it will just torment us with false alerts.
These hardware/scaling-related delays are a major pain because we have at least one other very significant feature that is held up for this.
Hmmmm, this is an interesting challenge. If you mark an album private or password-protected, you as the site owner will be able to search but your visitors won't. I'm sorry about that.
But in a way, your entire site will be private when you exercise option 2. It won't be discoverable via Google or Yahoo or via SmugMug's search. But once there, your visitors will be able to search for images in any gallery or category, because search is context-aware.
I hope this helps.
Thanks,
Chris
http://blogs.smugmug.com/don/2007/04/27/the-perfect-db-storage-array/
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
I know you'd love to beta test but we feel we have to run with this hardware in production for a week first to make sure all is stable. If any performance demands from SearchIslands spill over to other functionality, we'll get lynched by the mob.
Since I lost all the cool SmugMug functionality, I never converted to a paid account. Once this is up and running, I will be signing up for sure!
Kormac
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
It's 1:00 a.m. Tuesday night/Wednesday morning and we're testing until our eyes bleed. This is a very complex feature under the covers... The hope is to bring the site down Thursday night and go live Friday morning.
Then we'll need all eyes on it Friday morning to see if our testing caught everything. We're hoping for a quiet launch and to monitor the site through the Monday holiday before making much noise about this.
Thanks Baldy....this is great news! I can hardly wait to see what the Smugmug team has come up with, and look forward to exploring the new functionality this weekend.
Excellent news. Thanks.
Steve