Originally Posted by Howzit dpreview has completed their review of the Pentax K5: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk5/ ...seems like they like it.

I own a 5D Mark II, but I am planning on buying the K-5 + a few DA star lenses over a 1ds Mark III for super nasty weather shooting. A whole camera setup is cheaper than the damn 1ds Mark III body alone, and has more weather sealing! (I know resolution isn't as good but the features and DR are better... I do love Pentax!)

Originally Posted by Overfocused I own a 5D Mark II, but I am planning on buying the K-5 + a few DA star lenses over a 1ds Mark III for super nasty weather shooting. A whole camera setup is cheaper than the damn 1ds Mark III body alone, and has more weather sealing! (I know resolution isn't as good but the features and DR are better... I do love Pentax!)

For "super nasty weather shooting" I strongly suggest an additional protection for both camera and lens, if you want to prevent potential problems. Even a plastic bag gives a nice first line of protection.

Yeah I use bags a lot but I'm looking for a naked camera :)

The Pentax so far has the best weather protection. I'll have to look into making a nice fitted elastic bag rather than just grocery bags I really would prefer to keep my IQ. I've got all the silica gel I'll ever need and bags for letting it warm back up slowly... bags for now!

Originally Posted by Overfocused Yeah I use bags a lot but I'm looking for a naked camera :) The Pentax so far has the best weather protection. I'll have to look into making a nice fitted elastic bag rather than just grocery bags I really would prefer to keep my IQ. I've got all the silica gel I'll ever need and bags for letting it warm back up slowly... bags for now!

I don't think that Pentax weather seal technology is any better than the Canon 1D/1Ds or Nikon D3 series weather seal technology, but it is probably true to say that, given the price point, the Pentax K5 is using a very high level of weather seal technology for its price point.

WTG Pentax.

------------------------------

Do remember that the entire camera "system" is only as weather sealed as its weakest link. Use only sealed lenses and it is "your" responsibility for basic seal maintenance. Seals can fail at any time and often without warning.

Originally Posted by ziggy53 I don't think that Pentax weather seal technology is any better than the Canon 1D/1Ds or Nikon D3 series weather seal technology, but it is probably true to say that, given the price point, the Pentax K5 is using a very high level of weather seal technology for its price point. WTG Pentax. ------------------------------ Do remember that the entire camera "system" is only as weather sealed as its weakest link. Use only sealed lenses and it is "your" responsibility for basic seal maintenance. Seals can fail at any time and often without warning.

Aye... I got the lenses for Canon. That's the only reason I even allowed myself outside with the MKII. The k-5 is an exciting prospect in itself though! I think that should/will be my next goal is a 'tough' system with higher fps and a quicker AF system.

Good, I do like Pentax, but I'd like to see them level out their DSLR line. I think they're doing that well with the K-7 and K-5. Next is FF! (I really wonder if they'll ever go there. Probably not since they get their sensors from Sony (right?) and Sony is not doing FF sensors in the long run.

Originally Posted by ThatCanonGuy Good, I do like Pentax, but I'd like to see them level out their DSLR line. I think they're doing that well with the K-7 and K-5. Next is FF! (I really wonder if they'll ever go there. Probably not since they get their sensors from Sony (right?) and Sony is not doing FF sensors in the long run.

Pentax, at least for now, chose to go with a crop medium-format for their larger format offering.

http://www.pentaximaging.com/slr/645D/

cameralabs has completed their review of the Olympus PEN E-PL2

Originally Posted by Overfocused ... I am planning on buying the K-5 + a few DA star lenses ... I do love Pentax!)

I'm a Pentax fan too (love my 35mm film) and the K-5 looks sweet.

Originally Posted by ziggy53 Pentax, at least for now, chose to go with a crop medium-format for their larger format offering. http://www.pentaximaging.com/slr/645D/

I wanna borrow one for a year or five or ten... I'll give it back

Leica S2 if I win the lotto!

Originally Posted by Overfocused I wanna borrow one for a year or five or ten... I'll give it back Leica S2 if I win the lotto!

I researched, and continue to research, the medium format and large format digital options, including scanning digital backs for large format. I concluded that for my purposes and needs, which are mostly landscapes and vista landscapes, a panoramic head and multiple stitched images would meet my criteria best and it was something I could fairly easily afford now.

100+ megabyte images are a joy to review and 360 degree panoramics are an added bonus.

dpreview has completed their review of the Pentax K-r

So only main stream 35mm FF, or cropped sensor style DSLRs in this?? No Leica, Aptus, Mamiya, Phase One, Hasselblad or Pentax 645D?
That's a shame :(

The 645D is an amazing piece of kit and not that much more expensive than some of the pro level DSLRs - Due to the 645D cost, Mamiya/Phase One are dropping prices and 'Blad released the H4D-31 around that price bracket ...... Medium format digital (cropped or not) isn't the prohibitively expensive realm of high end professionals any more, but I get the feeling the big two from Canon and Nikon don't want that made common knowledge - and that flows to a lot of forums and sites catering to that fan base.

I know USD$10K isn't cheap, but I do find it amusing when you read comments from people you know have been caught in the upgrade trap whinging it's too much. One example - someone I know went through the Canon range with an entry level DSLR, upgraded that to something I forget the model number for, upgraded again to a 5D, then a 5DII, now wants to try and grab a 2nd hand 1DMkIII once the MkIV comes out .... and has a lot of L glass ....... and they had a go at me for "wasting" $12K on the 645D and new 2.8/55 prime to go with it! If it isn't cost, people will drag out the old critisisms of speed, noise at hi ISO and the like without bothering to see what the new breed of MF Digitals are capable of now.

If those tables can rate entry level/consumer grade cropped sensor DSLRs along with pro-level full frames - why aren't the Medium Formats included?

Because MF is definitely a niche... even some consumers still buy the FF cameras. The digital market is gaining huge momentum in magnitude for MF though. I think the 645D will bring much more awareness and add some pressure to the top canon/nikon models for the professional market. I'd rather get the 645D over a D3X any day

Originally Posted by Warped So only main stream 35mm FF, or cropped sensor style DSLRs in this?? No Leica, Aptus, Mamiya, Phase One, Hasselblad or Pentax 645D? That's a shame :( The 645D is an amazing piece of kit and not that much more expensive than some of the pro level DSLRs - Due to the 645D cost, Mamiya/Phase One are dropping prices and 'Blad released the H4D-31 around that price bracket ...... Medium format digital (cropped or not) isn't the prohibitively expensive realm of high end professionals any more, but I get the feeling the big two from Canon and Nikon don't want that made common knowledge - and that flows to a lot of forums and sites catering to that fan base. I know USD$10K isn't cheap, but I do find it amusing when you read comments from people you know have been caught in the upgrade trap whinging it's too much. One example - someone I know went through the Canon range with an entry level DSLR, upgraded that to something I forget the model number for, upgraded again to a 5D, then a 5DII, now wants to try and grab a 2nd hand 1DMkIII once the MkIV comes out .... and has a lot of L glass ....... and they had a go at me for "wasting" $12K on the 645D and new 2.8/55 prime to go with it! If it isn't cost, people will drag out the old critisisms of speed, noise at hi ISO and the like without bothering to see what the new breed of MF Digitals are capable of now. If those tables can rate entry level/consumer grade cropped sensor DSLRs along with pro-level full frames - why aren't the Medium Formats included?

Interesting comments, with which I tend to agree, and your mention of the "upgrade trap" is particularly apposite in the context of the discussions comparing models.

It seems that Canon will not be going the MF route, and I think they are wise not to. Instead, I think they will push the envelope with the 1D line towards the best of both worlds. That product will be as expensive as the MF cheapies now, but far superior in ease, performance, versatility, and quality, with a version to match your purposes.

Neil

Originally Posted by Warped So only main stream 35mm FF, or cropped sensor style DSLRs in this?? No Leica, Aptus, Mamiya, Phase One, Hasselblad or Pentax 645D? That's a shame :( ...?

dpreview and cameralabs concentrate more on the consumer/prosumer end of things. Higher volume, greater choice and more diverse reviews means greater viewership and commissions on sales from their vendor partners.

...yeah, it's a shame but money talks...

Originally Posted by NeilL Interesting comments, with which I tend to agree, and your mention of the "upgrade trap" is particularly apposite in the context of the discussions comparing models. It seems that Canon will not be going the MF route, and I think they are wise not to. Instead, I think they will push the envelope with the 1D line towards the best of both worlds. That product will be as expensive as the MF cheapies now, but far superior in ease, performance, versatility, and quality, with a version to match your purposes. Neil

With regards to ease of use, performance, versatility and quality - have you seen or tried one of the new 645Ds?

Yes I own one and am a bit biased, but I'm no Pentax Fan-boy and have owned and used cameras from a lot of different manufactures. I compared the 645D against 1DMkIII and D3x models and the Pentax is just as easy to use, if not easier and more intuitive than both of those cameras. The button layout and menu organisation is fantastic and super-easy to change settings, see what is set and it's customisable to set things the way you want them. The only way it could be easier to use would be a big red "Full Auto - Make my shots AWESOME" button and take all control off the photographer so you don't need to control anything .... and where's the fun in that

Performance ..... you really need to see a 24 x 32 inch print straight from the 645D! Every test I've seen so far puts the 645D miles ahead in Image Quality compared to any top of the range Full frame DSLR. I think it was Luminous Landscapes that compared the 645D to a Leica, a Phase One and a 1DMkIII and after the first few minutes they put the Canon away as it wasn't even in the same ball park. It was pointless to continue comparing the DSLR to the others for image quality, sharpness, dynamic range .....etc. When Canon or Nikon catch up to the 30+ Mpixel resolution, you can bet Hasselblad, Pentax, Mamiya ....etc will have made the next step with 50 or 60+ Mpixel setting the standard.

Quality - can't speak for the the other MF "cheapies" at the moment, but I can guarantee that the 645D is beautifully made and fully weather sealed - definitely a quality piece of kit!
'Blad glass, old Pentax glass, anything Leica .... they're all something a bit special and scream levels of quality I've yet to see or feel in modern DSLR gear.

The only area MF falls down in is versatility with a slow fps shooting rate, no video, and whilst the noise is no where near as bad as others would have you believe in carrying on the old MF/noise sterotype, ISO1600 is the maximum and it will require some noise reduction work.

Most people will buy a Large or Medium format system to one job, and do it REALLY well - so that's were I reckon the DSLR makers will concentrate efforts on. If you make a living from selling huge panorama prints, or work all day every day in the studio then MF will be an attractive option. But if you shoot weddings and include video, shoot landscapes for your own pleasure, like taking your camera to sporting events and make some cash on the side shooting family/kids/pet portraits and need an all rounder, only printing small (A3 or under) or 90% or more of your work is seen on the web, then yeah .... MF probably isn't for you

I just reckong it's a shame a lot of the more popular mags and sites don't cover the other options that are out there and in doing so help promote the upgrade trap

Originally Posted by Warped With regards to ease of use, performance, versatility and quality - have you seen or tried one of the new 645Ds? Yes I own one and am a bit biased, but I'm no Pentax Fan-boy and have owned and used cameras from a lot of different manufactures. I compared the 645D against 1DMkIII and D3x models and the Pentax is just as easy to use, if not easier and more intuitive than both of those cameras. The button layout and menu organisation is fantastic and super-easy to change settings, see what is set and it's customisable to set things the way you want them. The only way it could be easier to use would be a big red "Full Auto - Make my shots AWESOME" button and take all control off the photographer so you don't need to control anything .... and where's the fun in that Performance ..... you really need to see a 24 x 32 inch print straight from the 645D! Every test I've seen so far puts the 645D miles ahead in Image Quality compared to any top of the range Full frame DSLR. I think it was Luminous Landscapes that compared the 645D to a Leica, a Phase One and a 1DMkIII and after the first few minutes they put the Canon away as it wasn't even in the same ball park. It was pointless to continue comparing the DSLR to the others for image quality, sharpness, dynamic range .....etc. When Canon or Nikon catch up to the 30+ Mpixel resolution, you can bet Hasselblad, Pentax, Mamiya ....etc will have made the next step with 50 or 60+ Mpixel setting the standard. Quality - can't speak for the the other MF "cheapies" at the moment, but I can guarantee that the 645D is beautifully made and fully weather sealed - definitely a quality piece of kit! 'Blad glass, old Pentax glass, anything Leica .... they're all something a bit special and scream levels of quality I've yet to see or feel in modern DSLR gear. The only area MF falls down in is versatility with a slow fps shooting rate, no video, and whilst the noise is no where near as bad as others would have you believe in carrying on the old MF/noise sterotype, ISO1600 is the maximum and it will require some noise reduction work. Most people will buy a Large or Medium format system to one job, and do it REALLY well - so that's were I reckon the DSLR makers will concentrate efforts on. If you make a living from selling huge panorama prints, or work all day every day in the studio then MF will be an attractive option. But if you shoot weddings and include video, shoot landscapes for your own pleasure, like taking your camera to sporting events and make some cash on the side shooting family/kids/pet portraits and need an all rounder, only printing small (A3 or under) or 90% or more of your work is seen on the web, then yeah .... MF probably isn't for you I just reckong it's a shame a lot of the more popular mags and sites don't cover the other options that are out there and in doing so help promote the upgrade trap

Extremely interesting, thanks! From what you say, I think we could expect the competition to heat up between the flagship DSLRs and the new breed of MF. Should be a drama worth watching!

Another player, another battlefront, in the commercial success of both formats is in-camera, tethered, and post processing software, and degree of automation.

Neil

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