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Old Jul-17-2010, 06:52 AM
#1
akobiheritage is offline akobiheritage OP
Beginner grinner
shooting wedding without flash
I use Nikon. what setting is the best to shoot in church without flash
Old Jul-17-2010, 07:46 AM
#2
Blurmore is offline Blurmore
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I'll give you the standard answer for shooting with a hasselblad...(You'll need a tripod) 1/4sec f4 400iso. LOL...that worked 99% of the time....but seriously your questions is SO vague it is unanswerable...I will give you a hint though, your Nikon contains a VERY advanced meter you can view it in the bottom of the viewfinder if the camera is held in a horizontal orientation.
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Old Jul-17-2010, 08:20 AM
#3
Moogle Pepper is offline Moogle Pepper
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Don't worry about pumping up the ISO. Just do it.
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Old Jul-17-2010, 08:54 AM
#4
mmmatt is offline mmmatt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blurmore View Post
I'll give you the standard answer for shooting with a hasselblad...(You'll need a tripod) 1/4sec f4 400iso. LOL...that worked 99% of the time....but seriously your questions is SO vague it is unanswerable...I will give you a hint though, your Nikon contains a VERY advanced meter you can view it in the bottom of the viewfinder if the camera is held in a horizontal orientation.
Yeah, this question scares me! Part of me just wants to say "P" mode!

When I shoot candid ceremony shots I like to shoot in shutter priority mode because I have a better chance of correcting exposure in post than I do motion blur. You need to find out what your personal minimum handheld shutter speed is with your various lenses and not go below that. The rule of thumb is 1/xxx, where xxx=your focal length. Keep in mind that if you are shooting a crop sensor camera then you have to multiply your focal length by your crop factor for the proper calculation. So if you are shooting a camera that has a crop factor of 1.6 and are using a 200mm lens, you should be able to handhold at a shutter speed of 1/320th without problem. If you really work at it you should be able to do better than that, but better safe than sorry until you are confidant that you can handhold at slower speeds. Also using a VR or IS type lens will allow you to reduce that a couple of stops. Regardless of any of that though, you have to be aware that subject movement will show as motion blur regardless of your abilities, so my default absolute minimum for shooting action under ambient light at weddings is 1/80th but I try to stay at 1/100th or higher if at all possible. Depending on what body you are using you may or may not be pleased with the results using the higher iso settings. I often find myself shooting at iso 1000 or iso 1600 in churches, but iso 3200 comes into play sometimes as well. The final factor and the "seperating the men from the boys" factor is the lenses you use. Fast glass is very helpful for two reasons. First it allows you to shoot at a lower f-stop setting such as f2.8 or f2 so you get more exposure at higher shutter speeds or lower iso, and secondly because regardless of what aperture you set your camera, the lens will focus at it's lowest f-stop setting and in a dim room many lesser lenses will struggle even to find focus. Having atleast 1 peice of fast glass to use will allow you to take best advantage of available light and allow you to focus quickly and efficiently when there isn't much light to work with.

Hope that helps!

Good luck,
Matt
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Old Jul-17-2010, 12:05 PM
#5
Qarik is online now Qarik
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Sorry this a loaded question. Let me ask you...are you shooting officially for someone?
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Old Jul-17-2010, 12:23 PM
#6
Jeffro is offline Jeffro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akobiheritage View Post
I use Nikon. what setting is the best to shoot in church without flash
The one that gives you proper exposure without motion blur.

Shooting at 1/60 sec. is probably safe for normal movement, set your camera there and see what f-stop it wants, if your lens is limited to 5.6 you're pobably going to have to bump up the ISO.
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Old Jul-17-2010, 02:33 PM
#7
Te Amo is offline Te Amo
just a guy with a camera
how long is a piece of string?

your question is very vague, and there really is no one answer for it.
my first impression reading your question as written, is that youre not very experienced with this type of event. if thats the case, i would suggest not doing it at all.

of course the simple answer is:
fast glass (f/1.2-2.8)
high ISO (800+)
tripod
IS/VR
Old Jul-17-2010, 05:33 PM
#8
JayClark79 is offline JayClark79
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Why no flash? Not allowed? Or dont have one?
Have you been told no flash?
Who are you shooting for?

There's ALOT more info needed then "I use Nikon"
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Old Jul-17-2010, 08:07 PM
#9
Surfdog is offline Surfdog
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"I use Nikon" means very little. Which camera? What lenses do you have?
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Old Jul-19-2010, 07:55 PM
#10
Matthew Saville is offline Matthew Saville
Wedding Photographer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qarik View Post
Sorry this a loaded question. Let me ask you...are you shooting officially for someone?
Thanks Qarik. I'm gonna bite my tongue on this one...

=Matt=
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Old Jul-21-2010, 02:19 AM
#11
Chris Geiger is offline Chris Geiger
Pro Photographer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akobiheritage View Post
I use Nikon. what setting is the best to shoot in church without flash
The setting should be you, and a professional photographer talking about hiring the pro to do the job and having you shot second (or third) for him. You have no business shooting a wedding.

It's like a "Doctor" asking another doctor what knife he should be using to cut open a sick person. If the doctor does not know how to use the basic tools, the should not be doing operations.

You should be reading books and taking beginner photo classes for a few years before you consider as assignment as difficult as, wedding photography is.
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Old Jul-21-2010, 04:04 AM
#12
WillCAD is offline WillCAD
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Whoa, guys... give the newbie the benefit of the doubt! I'm going to assume that he/she is simply be a person who is attending the wedding as a guest and wants to know how to get some pics of the ceremony without flash. After all, many officials prohibit flash during the ceremony, or prohibit flash except for the pro photographer.

Akobiheritage, the answers that those who responded without yelling gave you are pretty good. Shooting indoor without flash means you either need a fast lens, or you'll need to show the shutter speed to let more light in. Of course, if you slow the shutter speed, you'll get motion blur, either from your body moving while you shoot, or from the subjects moving while you shoot.

The brand of camera is totally irrelevant; Nikon, Canon, Sony, Sigma, Hasselblad, and any other brand of camera all work pretty much the same. What's important is the type of camera, and its capabilities. Are you shooting a point-and-shoot camera, or an SLR? Does your camera (or lens) have some sort of image stabilization system? What is the ISO range of the camera? Does it have manual settings or just pre-set modes (like Landscape, Sports, Portrait, etc)? All of these things are important to getting any shot.

Conditions in the venue are also important. Indoor or outdoor? In sunlight or under cover? If inside, how brightly lit is the room? Natural or artificial light? Light from above, from the sides, or from behind the ceremony? Where will you be standing? Can you use a tripod? The answers to all of these questions will also influence what settings to use on your camera and what techniques to use when shooting.

But most important is how well you know those capabilities and how well you can use them. Your camera may have features that could allow you to get great shots indoors in low light, but they're useless if you don't know what they do and how to use them.

Always keep in mind: The camera doesn't take pictures - YOU take pictures. The camera is nothing more than a tool you use in the process.

A lot of people make the mistake of trying to "learn the camera." But what they should be doing is trying to learn photography. Knowledge of photographic principles and techniques will apply to any camera, any situation, and when you have that knowledge, the settings you use on any particular camera to achieve your intended shot will become self-evident.

Think of it like this - you play golf. You want to improve your golf game. If Tiger Woods suddenly loaned you his personal set of clubs, would your game improve over night? Maybe a little, if you were using really crappy clubs before, but not much. Which club to use in a particular situation is totally irrelevant if you don't know how to grip the club, how to swing, how to follow through, etc.

Good luck, and don't be deterred by those who jumped on you in this thread; some photographers are a little too defensive because there are a lot of idiots out there these days who think they're pro photographers just because they bought a camera with interchangeable lenses, and those idiots are having a negative effect on the industry.
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Old Jul-21-2010, 09:46 AM
#13
Te Amo is offline Te Amo
just a guy with a camera
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillCAD View Post
Whoa, guys... give the newbie the benefit of the doubt! I'm going to assume that he/she is simply be a person who is attending the wedding as a guest and wants to know how to get some pics of the ceremony without flash.
If this is the case, then then answer is much simpler.
The best setting for your camera is off.
If you're invited to such an event as a guest, then show up in that capacity. Leave your camera at home, and enjoy being a part.of your friend/relatives once in a lifetime event. This is not your opportunity to learn how to shoot a wedding. Clearly they have hired someone else because your work is not up to snuff, or because they like the work of the person they hired. They have a job to do, and you have a party to enjoy. Simple as that.

Also, this comes up on other boards sometimes, some wedding photographers have an "uncle bob" clause in their contract specifically because of people like this, and even the mere presence of your camera (flash or otherwise) can be a breach of the signed paperwork. between the hired photog, and the couple. Unless you can confirm with the hired photog that its ok, I wouldn't even chance it. It would suck to be the reason that key shots were missed, simply because you wanted to practice on someone else's clock.

If you're not the hired photog. Leave your camera at home, if for.no other reason than professional courtesy.
Old Jul-21-2010, 10:21 AM
#14
JVPhotography is offline JVPhotography
the edgy girl
A high ISO is the last thing to worry about in low light - a grainy photo you can at least turn to black and white to make it still look professional. You can't do anything if your shutter speed is too slow and the photo comes out blurry. Shoot wide open at a high ISO and your photos will normally be quite usable.
Old Jul-21-2010, 10:42 AM
#15
WillCAD is offline WillCAD
Grinning Buffoon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Te Amo View Post
If this is the case, then then answer is much simpler.
The best setting for your camera is off.
If you're invited to such an event as a guest, then show up in that capacity. Leave your camera at home, and enjoy being a part.of your friend/relatives once in a lifetime event. This is not your opportunity to learn how to shoot a wedding. Clearly they have hired someone else because your work is not up to snuff, or because they like the work of the person they hired. They have a job to do, and you have a party to enjoy. Simple as that.

Also, this comes up on other boards sometimes, some wedding photographers have an "uncle bob" clause in their contract specifically because of people like this, and even the mere presence of your camera (flash or otherwise) can be a breach of the signed paperwork. between the hired photog, and the couple. Unless you can confirm with the hired photog that its ok, I wouldn't even chance it. It would suck to be the reason that key shots were missed, simply because you wanted to practice on someone else's clock.

If you're not the hired photog. Leave your camera at home, if for.no other reason than professional courtesy.
Te, while you bring up some valid points, I think you're blowing the situation way out of proportion. And I think you're making some gross, unwarranted assumptions about the original poster.

Certainly, focussing on photography at the expense of enjoyment of any event seems as crazy to me as it does to you. However, photography is a hobby, and a very enjoyable one, to most Dgrinners, even those who make their living at it. Bringing my camera to a wedding - or any other event - does not detract from my enjoyment of the event in the slightest; in point of fact, it does the opposite. Photography isn't some distracting chore to me, it's an activity that I enjoy every bit as much as the music, dancing, and personal interaction with my family and friends when I attend a wedding as a guest. I am smart enough, and a well-balanced enough individual, not to allow my photographic hobby come between me and my enjoyment of family and friends at a wedding and other event; there is absolutely no reasono to assume that the OP is NOT capable of the same restraint.

Secondly, assuming that the OP's question means that he's trying to use the wedding as an "opportunity to learn how to shoot a wedding", is a baseless assumption not supported by any of the facts in evidence. I'm not saying he's NOT doing that, but he's only posted once, and assuming the worst from a single question is insulting and demeaning. He never said he's trying to become a wedding photographer, he just wants advice on getting better pics at a wedding.

Your comment that "Clearly they have hired someone else because your work is not up to snuff, or because they like the work of the person they hired" is also an uncalled-for personal insult, for which I think you owe the OP an apology.

I greatly support the Uncle Bob clauses in pro photographers' contracts. I have encountered Uncle Bob types at many weddings and despise that sort of behavior; not only is it horribly inconvenient for the pro, but it's extremely inconsiderate, rude, and disrespectful to the bride and groom, as well. However, I don't recall ever hearing about an Uncle Bob clause that completely prohibits any and all guests from bringing their own cameras to the wedding; such a provision is ludicrous, unenforcable, and just plain silly. What's the pro going to do if Uncle Bob or Aunt Marge bring their own camera - walk off the job just before the ceremony? Hold the deliverables hostage until the bride and groom fork over an Uncle Bob surcharge? Nothing would kill a wedding photographer's reputation faster than childish and reprehensible behavior like that, and I seriously doubt you'd find any Drinners who would ever consider it.

On the other hand, you certainly have valid points about the Uncle Bobs interfering with the hired photographer's performance of his job. I will not defend the Uncle Bobs who do so. But advocating the complete absense of any cameras other than the pro's is a ridiculously extreme position.

The OP asked a simple, basic question about photography. The question makes it obvious that he's a beginner; however, he never said or implied anything that would lead a reasonable person to believe that he's trying to shoot the wedding professionally, nor did he say or imply that he intended to do anything which might impede the pro photographer's ability to do his job, nor did he say or imply anything that might lead a reasonable person to think that he's trying to learn how to shoot wedding well enough to become a pro wedding photographer by ruining someone's wedding. All he wants to know is what settings work best for shooting a wedding with no flash.
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Old Jul-21-2010, 11:05 AM
#16
Te Amo is offline Te Amo
just a guy with a camera
Since you decided to write a book with your response, I didn't bother to read through it, however I will address your clear confusion on a key point.
I have made absolutely no assumption about the OP. Rather, I addressed your previous assumption.

Quote:
I'm going to assume that he/she is simply be a person who is attending the wedding as a guest...
After which I stated, if that were the case, then this is the solution. Never once did I imply any of it was actually the current scenario.

Unlike yourself, I have not made any assumptions about the OP before even getting a response. Perhaps you should spend less time assuming. Your entire post is based on an assumption that I made an assumption about your assumption.
I can see why you're confused.
Old Jul-21-2010, 11:56 AM
#17
BuddyLee is offline BuddyLee
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The bickering amongst the wedding photogs on this site at times makes me not want to ever be called a wedding photographer. The question is vague, and maybe not a very good question in the first place. But public forums are where people come to ask and learn. No need for personal disrespect. I'm losing my interest in dgrin more and more.
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Old Jul-21-2010, 01:14 PM
#18
Moogle Pepper is offline Moogle Pepper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddyLee View Post
The bickering amongst the wedding photogs on this site at times makes me not want to ever be called a wedding photographer. The question is vague, and maybe not a very good question in the first place. But public forums are where people come to ask and learn. No need for personal disrespect. I'm losing my interest in dgrin more and more.
honestly, any photography forum you go to - there will be the same kind of response.
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Last edited by Moogle Pepper; Jul-21-2010 at 04:20 PM.
Old Jul-21-2010, 04:14 PM
#19
Icebear is offline Icebear
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Moderator?????
Old Jul-21-2010, 11:00 PM
#20
ImageX Photography is offline ImageX Photography
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Wow, is this for real? Someone just made a GIGANTIC ASS out of themselves and clearly has issues dealing with social situations.

OP, only an ASS assumes so I wouldn't waste your time with pure ignorant garbage. Don't let anyone tell you what to do. You go to that wedding if you want, bring your fastest lens, take lots of pics, and learn from it all. Have a good time and say hi to Uncle Bob for me!
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