Pro account - E-commerce friendly ?

zedEL · August 16, 2005

I've signed up with the Pro account about two months ago, with one thing in mind - to sell my images to potential buyers.
So far nothing sold.
I think my images are of the good enough quality and originality to be marketable. I also paid attention that I get very little views, although I assigned good quality keywords to my photos.

So, today as I was thinking what's wrong, I thought about this:
- why those who come to Smugmug to look and Buy good images have only one option of searching - this whole huge website ???
Obviously, majority of people who paid $100 for a Pro account, have the same objective - to sell their images.

So, the next question is this:
with the investment of $100 for each year, why not to give the Pro account holders more visibility and exposure, and at the same time to make Buyers' lives much easier, when looking for certain images ??
Give them the option to search the Pro only.

Why would a buyer waste his/her time looking at the search results and seeing somebody's family pictures by the lake, when all he/she wanted was to get good quality photographic prints of a lake or a certain lake ???:scratch

I don't think anybody would mind to pay a bit more for this.
I think it's a fair request.

And one more question:
Why there is no simple and very visible link for Bueyrs ?
I know there is "browse", "search"...
The Pro account is an Ecommerce account, and as such, it should have very basic keywords: BUY or PURCHASE right on the first page of Smugmug, in order to make it clear to a visitor that there are images for sale.
This is very important for the search engines as well.
And it will bring much more needed traffic.
According to Alexa.com, Pbase has 920 reach per million(920 people view this site out of million); SM has only 233 per million.

Thanks!

digital faerie · August 16, 2005

I would just love to know how the search function works period.

And you make an intriguing point.

Andy · August 16, 2005

i've never sold a single photo to someone who just wandered onto smugmug

but i've sold hundreds and hundreds and licensed may images, by virture of my phone calls, requesting referrals, passing out cards, unsolicited proposals, and more.

in other words, imo with hard work, and some good, basic sales & marketing skills, you can get there, but it doesn't just happen automatically, pro-only search or not....

cheers

zedEL · August 16, 2005

I know that Andy.

But the whole idea behind E-commerce and particularly, Pro Acc. here, is to market the images online.
I know, I can go out and put my postcards everywhere i stop, to put them in hundreds of magazines, to solicit...to advertise...etc.
This is the old way. We're at the new age of online discovery....
(here we go..I get so smoothly into 70s rock...;-))
You paid $100 and you gona pay again $100 for the next year...
Why do you pay $100 ?
You could have easily get sattisfied with $25, right ?
But you paid $100, because you wanted to SELL your art ONLINE, with the HELP of SMUGMUG.
Am I right ?
Sure, we get for $100 very nice features. But these features are for us, not for buyers.
What about the buyers that we want ?
We want these people to find us at the PRO account. Not at the consumer account.
HOW ? JUST LET THEM SEARCH OUR BASE !
And not to waste THEIR time looking at the pictures of a picnic-by-the-lake.

Search engines will pick it up and will bring more traffic and the right people.

To have "BUY" on the first page is of paramount importance.

zedEL · August 16, 2005

digital faerie wrote:

I would just love to know how the search function works period. And you make an intriguing point.

Thank you:):

Andy · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

But you paid $100, because you wanted to SELL your art ONLINE, with the HELP of SMUGMUG.
Am I right ?

is there somewhere where smugmug says that they will provide help to sell your work?

hard work, good photos = sales imo.

gus · August 16, 2005

digital faerie wrote:

I would just love to know how the search function works period. And you make an intriguing point.

What dont you understand about it DF ? Maybe we can assist.

mercphoto · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

But the whole idea behind E-commerce and particularly, Pro Acc. here, is to market the images online.

You seem to have believed the e-commerce myth of "post it and they will come". It takes a lot more than simply assigning keywords to photos and getting into Google to actually sell anything.

You are going to need to do good old fashioned marketing if you want to sell anything.

ChibiPhotography · August 16, 2005

digital faerie wrote:

I would just love to know how the search function works period.

Search is based on keywords, look at this page for more on keywords.
http://www.smugmug.com/help/keywords-tags

How to implement your own seach is partially covered in the help pages, look at the "Your own search box" heading towards the bottom of this page: http://www.smugmug.com/help/custom-colors

Here is the original sample:

<form method="get" action="/search/index.mg">
<input type="text" name="searchWords" />
<input type="hidden" name="searchType" value="InUser" />
<input type="hidden" name="NickName" value="yournickname" />
<input type="submit" value="Search Galleries" />
</form>

Here is an improved version by taking tags from an SM header:

<div id="toolbar" class="nav">
<form name="searchBox" id="searchBox" method="get" action="/search/index.mg" onsubmit="checkInput('search','searchWords',' ')">
<input type="text" onclick="checkInput('search','searchWordsShort','')" onblur="checkInput('','searchWordsShort','search')" id="searchWordsShort" name="searchWordsShort" value="search" autocomplete="off"/>
<input type="hidden" name="searchType" value="InUser" />
<input type="hidden" name="NickName" value="yournickname" />
<input type="image" src="/img/spacer.gif" alt="Submit Search" title="Submit Search" class="searchglass" onClick="if(document.searchBox.searchWords.value == 'search') { document.searchBox.searchWords.value = ' '; }" />
</form>
</div>

Note:
For the "searchType" input, you can use value="InUser" or value="Global" to search either your own site or everyone's site. This brings up a different question, are there any other valid search types?

mercphoto · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

I know, I can go out and put my postcards everywhere i stop, to put them in hundreds of magazines, to solicit...to advertise...etc.
This is the old way. We're at the new age of online discovery....

I want to add to what I already replied, because I think this is important. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what it takes to sell stuff. THE INTERNET IS A NEW WAY OF SELLING ITEMS, BUT IT DOES NOT REPLACE ACTUALLY MARKETING ITEMS. In other words, its just a way of showing people product and allowing them to buy, just like mail order, or phone order, or a retail store outlet is. Selling is not the same as marketing.

But you still need to get your name out there. You still need people to be aware of who you are. There is absolutely nothing about the Internet or e-commerce that changes the rules that you need to market yourself to your customers. Google is not a marketing strategy.

It is not the "old way". It is the only way.

zedEL · August 16, 2005

I know very well the marketing and publicity stuff.

But what I do expect is the simple and important things on which the Ecommerce is based. Like the word "BUY"...or "BUYERS"...

You see, there are people out there who are looking at this very moment for nice looking photographs, for different purposes,...they have one purpose today, which is to BUY.
Now, Smugmug has to offer to these people a lot of good stuff.
So, the only thing left, is to bring both parties together.

Lets assume, somebody walked in, into Smugmug store. He/she found it searching Yahoo or google, or even read about smugmug in today's paper.
They have in mind to buy a print, because she/he knows that only here they will find truly one of a kind photo.
They see the first page with a few very colorful photos, they see a small word that says "Pro-Sell", then they see somewhere on the bottom "shopping cart"... But they are still looking for a few seconds more, maybe a minute or two...
Do you know what they are looking for ?
Yes...they want to find this BIG MOUTH word : BUY !
Now they are confused, they are not asked to BUY.
They see search button, browse button... but nobody is asking to BUY.

As a former marketing executive, I know that the word BUY is a magic word.
You need to ask to BUY. If you don't ask, you loose the sale.
That is the main principle in sales.

mercphoto · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

I know very well the marketing and publicity stuff.

My apologies. You definitely came across the type who thought all you needed to do was post, keyword, and let the magic of Google take over.

That said, you are a former marketing guy, so start marketing. You can put whatever text you want in a gallery description. I suggest <font size="+20">BUY</font>

zedEL · August 16, 2005

mercphoto wrote:

My apologies. You definitely came across the type who thought all you needed to do was post, keyword, and let the magic of Google take over.

That said, you are a former marketing guy, so start marketing. You can put whatever text you want in a gallery description. I suggest <font size="+20">BUY</font>

:
sorry, I didn't finish my "speach"...had to step out for a few moments.
Yeah...the "BUY" is missing at the entrance.
I wasn't talking about galleries, but about putting the word BUY on the front page.
There is word "sell" , the word "shopping cart"...fine.
But the word BUY is NOT THERE!
Bill, put yourself in the shoes of somebody who came to Smugmug and wants to BUY a print of the nice looking lake with trees(without girls...<img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/mwink.gif" border="0" alt="" > )
Would you get confused a little ? maybe more than little ?
You're used to see and hear this word BUY everywhere you go - online offline. You bought some books at Amazon.com and the word BUY is very clear and visible right at the first page. So you know, you just have to find what you want and then BUY.
But here no BUY.
The word BUY is the gateway to a sale.
Smugug needs to put this word right there, at the TOP, which will lead to the search at the PRO accounts database.

TWO simple things, that will help tremendously.
I'm surprised, that the Big Papa don't see that and didn't see that.

To summ up:

Smugmug needs to implement two very basic things:

1. To put clearly visible "BUY" at the top of the fron page
2. to link "BUY" to the next page, to SEARCH PRO ACC. database

That's all.
Is PRO Acc. an Ecommerce ? Yes.
Then give the customers the ability to search the PRO database and BUY there.
Is that the whole purpose of the PRO account ? Mainly.

Thanks!

:

colourbox · August 16, 2005

If someone encounters smugmug through Google, it seems unlikely that they would end up on smugmug's home page. They're going to end up on somebody's gallery or photo page due to the keywords they used.

I seriously doubt people are going to think "I need to find a photo of a lighthouse for my brochure, better check flickr and pbase and smugmug!" I think those people are much more likely to go to a dedicated stock photo house such as istockphoto.com, where they know they will never encounter pictures of baby at the picnic table. If their first intentional stop is a photo-sharing site for that purpose, I believe they are more likely trying to find and sneak off with a downloaded image (theft), unless there is actual data to show that photo-sharing sites alone are more effective sales tools than dedicated stock photo houses. I know that when I visit those other photo sites, I just want to see what's going on, I'm not looking to buy anything.

Seems like most smugmuggers who are selling have a pre-built audience from an event or group marketed outside of smugmug, like a wedding or athletic events.

mercphoto · August 16, 2005

Fine. Goto account customization. Edit your style sheets, etc. Place BUY everywhere.

Dude, I really don't know what your problem is. Solutions abound for what you want to do. Just do it.

zedEL · August 16, 2005

colourbox wrote:

If someone encounters smugmug through Google, it seems unlikely that they would end up on smugmug's home page. They're going to end up on somebody's gallery page due to the keywords.

I seriously doubt people are going to think "I need to find a photo of a lighthouse for my brochure, better check flickr and pbase and smugmug!" I think those people are much more likely to go to a dedicated stock photo house such as istockphoto.com, where they know they will never encounter pictures of baby at the picnic table. If their first intentional stop is a photo-sharing site for that purpose, I believe they are more likely trying to find and sneak off with a downloaded image (theft), unless there is actual data to show that photo-sharing sites alone are more effective sales tools than dedicated stock photo houses. I know that when I visit those other photo sites, I just want to see what's going on, I'm not looking to buy anything.

Seems like most smugmuggers who are selling have a pre-built audience from an event or group marketed outside of smugmug, like a wedding or athletic events.

I know what you're saying. Yes there are quite a few who do the events.
But I can tell you, that many many more are not the events guys.
Smugmug gets enough publicity. It's everywhere in the media and I'm sure most people know. And if someone doesn't know, then yahoo(i hate google for different reasons) will give them smugmug or pbase or...
But it doesn't matter what the result is gona be - it's gona be Smugmug's website. If it's somebody's gallery, fine. People today know the way around the internet. Right at the top they click "home" and then BUY.
But good point colourbox. BUY should be on every page.

Andy · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

Then give the customers the ability to search the PRO database and BUY there.
Is that the whole purpose of the PRO account ? Mainly.

mainly? not imo. there are loads of pros who do weddings, portraits,events, and other stuff, where they have worked hard to get their customers and potential customers to visit *their* site - they don't expect an unknown searcher to come to smugmug.com and search for a portrait of aunt frannie or a shot of their kid in the little league game.

thanks for your suggestions, zedel, we appreciate the feedback.

Andy · August 16, 2005

pro customization
btw, zedel- it only take about an hours worth of effort to put up some basic co-branding (customization) on your pro site, and i'd highly recommend it - also, i'd suggest making an effort to feature only your best photos, and organize your site in a way that's potential buyer friendly..

there are loads of suggestions, tips, and how-tos in the cobranding thread right here in the smugmug support forum. i'm not a programmer, don't know html and was able to totally customize my site myself, with help from the good smug staff and my fellow dgrinners - it's a cinch!

also - have you noticed, with the new release, that every photo on your site now say "buy" right on top of it?

cheers

zedEL · August 16, 2005

mercphoto wrote:

Fine. Goto account customization. Edit your style sheets, etc. Place BUY everywhere.

Dude, I really don't know what your problem is. Solutions abound for what you want to do. Just do it.

I think you don't read my whole posting.
I don't want to customize my gallery with the word BUY.
I'm very happy with all the options.
For you it doesn't matter and you completely miss the point, because you don't hear what I'm saying, dude
You do your events and the rest you don't care.
But you're not the only one here.
Majority are not eventshooters.

I do not want to add anything on my own, because I'm happy with what I'm provided .

What I'm saying is this, and it's for your own benefit:

The front page of SMUGMUG is missing the word "BUY"
I know, you don't care.
As you know, probably, every ecommerce website, needs to have this word right at the front.."buy today"..."buy now"...buy...buy...buy...
It's a PILLAR of every commerce, as you might know.
Do you ask your customers to BUY ?
So, why Smugmug doesn't ask ? not at the gallery level, but at the front page.
And for $100 why not give the buyers the option of searching PRO database only ?

Because that's why they are here - TO BUY.

I hope you managed to read to the end, dude

zedEL · August 16, 2005

andy wrote:

btw, zedel- it only take about an hours worth of effort to put up some basic co-branding (customization) on your pro site, and i'd highly recommend it - also, i'd suggest making an effort to feature only your best photos, and organize your site in a way that's potential buyer friendly..

there are loads of suggestions, tips, and how-tos in the cobranding thread right here in the smugmug support forum. i'm not a programmer, don't know html and was able to totally customize my site myself, with help from the good smug staff and my fellow dgrinners - it's a cinch!

also - have you noticed, with the new release, that every photo on your site now say "buy" right on top of it?

cheers

Andy, you too miss the point.
1. the word BUY should be at the FRONT PAGE, not more not less.
2. And then to SEARCH the PRO database.
I know you don't care either, because you're busy with your weddings and bar-mitzvahs(mazal tov

)..

This will make easier for people to find the right photos.
Don't we want to make their stay on smugmug pleasant and enjoyable ?
the same marketing and publicity principles apply online as well.
The site looks attractive from the "JOINING & SHARING" point of view .

Does it look attractive from the BUYING point of view ? NO.

There is a small problem of so called "usability" at the front page.

BUY and SEARCH PRO DATABASE - this is what is missing AT THE FRONT PAGE.

It will benefit those who care, not you ofcourse

Maki · August 16, 2005

There are many ways customers end up on a smugmug account. What I would like to see, and this may somewhat align to what you are hoping for, is a easier way for Joe-Buyer to land on www.smugmug.com, and be able to click a link to all users.

Perhaps even allow Joe to filter between Standard, Power, & Pro users to see how each user is making the most of each benefit.

Now, the main idea here is for Joe to view Pro, since that would be the only account allowing print purchases. Standard & Power users shouldn't be neglected, and it would be a nice directory of sorts... I guess what I'm desiring the most would be a way for Joe to navigate to & around relevant pages with ease, and possibly boost sales while he's at it. Somewhat akin to how Pbase handles galleries... Joe would only have to go to the main page, and click on the header Galleries to start his way...

The only thing that I would request along with this feature would be some sort of main switch that the user can customize to allow their site to be listed or not, to maintain privacy, if they wish.

Andy · August 16, 2005

zedEL wrote:

Andy, you too miss the point.
1. the word BUY should be at the FRONT PAGE, not more not less.
2. And then to SEARCH the PRO database.
I know you don't care either, because you're busy with your weddings and bar-mitzvahs(mazal tov )..

This will make easier for people to find the right photos.
Don't we want to make their stay on smugmug pleasant and enjoyable ?
the same marketing and publicity principles apply online as well.
The site looks attractive from the "JOINING & SHARING" point of view .

Does it look attractive from the BUYING point of view ? NO.

There is a small problem of so called "usability" at the front page.

BUY and SEARCH PRO DATABASE - this is what is missing AT THE FRONT PAGE.

It will benefit those who care, not you ofcourse

zedel, i have tried to be helpful, and courteous - i even took the time to look at your site and offer up some suggestions. you've repeated the same thing over and over again 5 times in this thread, we get it (that's why i also thanked you for your input).

as nothing new is being added, i'm closing this thread.... you may of course start another if you like, this one's run it's course - we hear you loud and clear and thanks again for the input

Pro account - E-commerce friendly ?

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