“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston
Looks like a nice upgrade, but I'll probably just stick with the original version of the 70-200 f/2.8 IS. The MTF chart of the new version is better but not THAT much better, and the original lens was sharp as hell from f/3.2 on up to the diffraction limit. AF may be faster in the new model but the old version was already fast. IS looks to be better but I've been pretty happy with the IS in the existing lens. I don't see anything here that makes this upgrade all that compelling for people who already own the 70-200 f/2.8 IS, compared to, say the 16-35 II or the TS-E 24 II, which turned good but not outstanding lenses into real killers.
Canon doesn't seem to have announced a price for this new lens, but I'm seeing a lot of crazy speculation online about MSRP as high as US$4400, which is just insane. Canon has never doubled the price of a lens when introducing a II version as far as I can recall. There are online stores that are asking crazy prices for this lens right now, but that's because they're trying to get extra profits from people who absolutely have to be the first on their block to get the new model. Once this lens becomes widely available, I doubt you'll have to pay more for it than you would for the equivalent Nikon lens, which is more expensive than Canon's original 70-200 f/2.8 IS but not THAT much more.
Think there will be a price drop for the Mark I version? I am in the market for this lens, but need it before the April release date (early March). Hoping to take advantage of this release somehow!!
Think there will be a price drop for the Mark I version?
In the short term, possibly. Once the II is actually available, I expect the original version to be discontinued, and at that point you may be able to get a good deal on one.
In the short term, possibly. Once the II is actually available, I expect the original version to be discontinued, and at that point you may be able to get a good deal on one.
And watch for the older mkI's to be for sale in the flea market forum.
Yes, looks like a very worthy redesign on Canon's workhorse lens. The pros, and evryone else, will love the mkII even more. Very glad I bought my 70-200 f/4 L IS a year ago at 1/3 the price of this new 2.8.
My Smugmug
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
And watch for the older mkI's to be for sale in the flea market forum.
Yes, looks like a very worthy redesign on Canon's workhorse lens. The pros, and evryone else, will love the mkII even more. Very glad I bought my 70-200 f/4 L IS a year ago at 1/3 the price of this new 2.8.
Of course not. Why would Canon give up all the free advertising they get just from photographers walking around with those very recognizable white telephoto lenses?
It looks like I'm gonna upgrade when it becomes available (April 2010).
If anyone wants dibs on my "original" version (i.e. "mark I":-) let me know..
Is there a particular aspect of the new model that persuades you that it's worth upgrading, or is the expense just not that significant for you?
I could afford the new model if I really wanted to, but if I was going to spend $2000+ on another Canon-brand lens at this point, it would probably be the 14mm f/2.8L II. The old 70-200mm f/2.8 IS is good enough to keep me happy for a long time to come, I think.
Is there a particular aspect of the new model that persuades you that it's worth upgrading, or is the expense just not that significant for you?
I could afford the new model if I really wanted to, but if I was going to spend $2000+ on another Canon-brand lens at this point, it would probably be the 14mm f/2.8L II. The old 70-200mm f/2.8 IS is good enough to keep me happy for a long time to come, I think.
OK, being serious:
1) extra IS stop
2) better/faster AF
3) better barrel
4) shorter min focusing distance
With 70-200/2.8 IS USM being one of my most used lens, better version makes total sense.
Not to be a jerk, but isn't all that subjective?
1) extra is stop. So starting at 1/200th, to 1/100th, 1/50th. 1/25th for the old version, 1/13th for the new.
Are you really going to be trying for that without a tripod? I would, but would you?
2) better/faster AF. I'd wait for reviews on this, or at least go to a shop with the old version and try them out side by side.
3) better barrel. I didn't read the entire page, but I haven't heard of a lot of these lenses falling apart.
4) shorter MFD. I guess that could help, but it's only 8 inches. instead of being 4' 6'" away you'll be 3' 10".
If they could have made it a macro I think that could be a selling point, ya know, cutting 2 feet of the MFD, but 8 inches, that's only half the length of one of my feet.
I'm guessing that they did their testing on the latest pro body. I wonder if someone using last years camera will reap the rewards promised by this new version.
I'm just getting old and jaded. I hear so much about new and improved, when the rewards are very minimal most of the time.
I hope the new lens is fantastic, and raises your photography to a new level.
1) extra is stop. So starting at 1/200th, to 1/100th, 1/50th. 1/25th for the old version, 1/13th for the new.
Are you really going to be trying for that without a tripod? I would, but would you?
I seem to do it rather often. Sunset shots are typical low light scenarios, and I hate tripods...
2) better/faster AF. I'd wait for reviews on this, or at least go to a shop with the old version and try them out side by side.
I doubt they would advertise it if it wasn't true...
3) better barrel. I didn't read the entire page, but I haven't heard of a lot of these lenses falling apart.
True, but I'd feel better:-)
4) shorter MFD. I guess that could help, but it's only 8 inches. instead of being 4' 6'" away you'll be 3' 10".
I agree, it's a minor thing, yet again in my line of shooting sometimes I *really* want to get closer to my model... You know, as they say, "every inch helps"... ;-)
I'm guessing that they did their testing on the latest pro body. I wonder if someone using last years camera will reap the rewards promised by this new version.
I'm using 5D2 and 7D. When new body comes out, I'll most likely upgrade. Yes, I know it's not 1D series, but those I really can't justify - I don't do sports.
I'm just getting old and jaded. I hear so much about new and improved, when the rewards are very minimal most of the time.
I hope the new lens is fantastic, and raises your photography to a new level.
Most of the pictures I'm taking could be taken with Canon 10D and a kit lens. Yet here I am, using latest bodies and L glass, as well as latest computer, latest OS, latest PS, etc.
So, if my pictures suck, I know for sure: it's me, cause I don't have any excuses. Kinda helps keeping me on my toes....
“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston
Did you guys realize that Canon just discontinued the 70-200mm f/2.8 L non-IS ? That sucks!
It reduces choices, but it probably makes sense from Canon's marketing perspective. They had four 70-200 L models, and two of them (f/4 IS and f/2.8 non-IS) were very close together in price. Most likely, they wanted to simplify the lineup into distinct price levels -- f/4 non-IS for people on a tight budget, f/4 IS for people who can spend a little more, and f/2.8 IS for those who can afford the top-of-the-line.
What surprises me, though, is that they haven't already removed the old f/2.8 IS from the list. Maybe they're just waiting to clear out their stock of it, but it's kind of odd seeing I and II versions of the same lens shown as current production items.
Btw, a little more on possible pricing: Someone in the comments on canonrumors.com (I know, not necessarily a reliable source) says that the new Nikon 70-200mm f/2.8 VR is listed by Calumet Germany at 2499 euros, but Calumet US sells the same lens for $2399. If this is correct, then a simple currency conversion between euros and dollars is not useful for estimating American prices for lenses based on European reports. Calumet Germany has the new Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L II IS listed for 2399 Euros. Perhaps we can hope, then, that American street price for this lens will be less than $2399 -- which is about what I expected.
1) extra is stop. So starting at 1/200th, to 1/100th, 1/50th. 1/25th for the old version, 1/13th for the new.
Are you really going to be trying for that without a tripod? I would, but would you?
2) better/faster AF. I'd wait for reviews on this, or at least go to a shop with the old version and try them out side by side.
3) better barrel. I didn't read the entire page, but I haven't heard of a lot of these lenses falling apart.
4) shorter MFD. I guess that could help, but it's only 8 inches. instead of being 4' 6'" away you'll be 3' 10".
If they could have made it a macro I think that could be a selling point, ya know, cutting 2 feet of the MFD, but 8 inches, that's only half the length of one of my feet.
I'm guessing that they did their testing on the latest pro body. I wonder if someone using last years camera will reap the rewards promised by this new version.
I'm just getting old and jaded. I hear so much about new and improved, when the rewards are very minimal most of the time.
I hope the new lens is fantastic, and raises your photography to a new level.
I'm with you Dave (though neither old nor jaded ). It's just Canon creaming off the excess affluence from those who are incontinent in such things. You're absolutely right that we can be willing dupes and fall in the feeding trough, or hard-headed dudes and demand meaningful improvements for our money. MkI of this lens has been a real money spinner for Canon, I guess, so they have to "recreate" it, apparently, to keep this honey pot attractive and competitive. It comes down to mainly a benefit for Canon, a marketing strategy, dressed up as an upgrade for us. A bit like the 50D, which was quickly seen as a bit of a fizzer as an "upgrade", and in that respect caused red faces of embarrassment very quickly on those who hailed it and rushed it. It's the way the market works, we can't blame Canon, but we can be smarter than they take us for.
Well it isn't like Canon upgrades this lens every year. So they really aren't milking the affluence. Plus they are in competition with Nikon and its 70-200 which is really sweet.
Well it isn't like Canon upgrades this lens every year. So they really aren't milking the affluence. Plus they are in competition with Nikon and its 70-200 which is really sweet.
If they were like computer goods, or electronics, that get constantly upgrades every year with minimal upgrades, then i can see the claim that they are milking the consumers. But when was the last time the 70-200 f2.8 IS was updated before this one? Once! And then look at how long the 2.8 IS has been out for?
If they were like computer goods, or electronics, that get constantly upgrades every year with minimal upgrades, then i can see the claim that they are milking the consumers. But when was the last time the 70-200 f2.8 IS was updated before this one? Once! And then look at how long the 2.8 IS has been out for?
Thanks, can you set the MSRP of the IS II to 1499 too .. please
“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston
Okay, well, that takes care of some of our recent speculations. I guess the lesson here is that whenever something changes on Canon's web site, wait 72 hours before you believe it, because they don't have their web act together enough to make changes without making a mess of things.
Okay, well, that takes care of some of our recent speculations. I guess the lesson here is that whenever something changes on Canon's web site, wait 72 hours before you believe it, because they don't have their web act together enough to make changes without making a mess of things.
Are you a Canon basher, or do I get the wrong impression from your last several posts here and elsewhere? rofl
"We" are a component of the market that Canon seeks and fills. If the global market for the new lens "tanks" because of low sales, Canon would no doubt adjust the price accordingly and accept reduced profits.
If the global market accepts the new lens and new price, then Canon has properly read the market and reaps the profit.
The curious thing is that if manufacturer prices get too high, it creates a favorable opportunity for a third-party manufacturer to create a competing product. If Sigma, for instance, wished it could probably create a 70-200mm, f2.8 OS (their version of IS). If they also sell at a better price point and if their quality (image and build) is sufficient, they might capture some of the available market share for 70-200mm, f2.8 stabilized lenses.
It's all a careful game of "guts" and a dance, in which we get to participate with our dollars and "sense".
"We" are a component of the market that Canon seeks and fills. If the global market for the new lens "tanks" because of low sales, Canon would no doubt adjust the price accordingly and accept reduced profits.
If the global market accepts the new lens and new price, then Canon has properly read the market and reaps the profit.
The curious thing is that if manufacturer prices get too high, it creates a favorable opportunity for a third-party manufacturer to create a competing product. If Sigma, for instance, wished it could probably create a 70-200mm, f2.8 OS (their version of IS). If they also sell at a better price point and if their quality (image and build) is sufficient, they might capture some of the available market share for 70-200mm, f2.8 stabilized lenses.
It's all a careful game of "guts" and a dance, in which we get to participate with our dollars and "sense".
Could I borrow your "rose colored glasses" sometime, Ziggy?! D
Comments
Looks like a nice upgrade, but I'll probably just stick with the original version of the 70-200 f/2.8 IS. The MTF chart of the new version is better but not THAT much better, and the original lens was sharp as hell from f/3.2 on up to the diffraction limit. AF may be faster in the new model but the old version was already fast. IS looks to be better but I've been pretty happy with the IS in the existing lens. I don't see anything here that makes this upgrade all that compelling for people who already own the 70-200 f/2.8 IS, compared to, say the 16-35 II or the TS-E 24 II, which turned good but not outstanding lenses into real killers.
Canon doesn't seem to have announced a price for this new lens, but I'm seeing a lot of crazy speculation online about MSRP as high as US$4400, which is just insane. Canon has never doubled the price of a lens when introducing a II version as far as I can recall. There are online stores that are asking crazy prices for this lens right now, but that's because they're trying to get extra profits from people who absolutely have to be the first on their block to get the new model. Once this lens becomes widely available, I doubt you'll have to pay more for it than you would for the equivalent Nikon lens, which is more expensive than Canon's original 70-200 f/2.8 IS but not THAT much more.
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
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In the short term, possibly. Once the II is actually available, I expect the original version to be discontinued, and at that point you may be able to get a good deal on one.
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
And watch for the older mkI's to be for sale in the flea market forum.
Yes, looks like a very worthy redesign on Canon's workhorse lens. The pros, and evryone else, will love the mkII even more. Very glad I bought my 70-200 f/4 L IS a year ago at 1/3 the price of this new 2.8.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
We are selling some of ours! http://www.borrowlenses.com/product/For_Sale/Canon_70-200mm_f2.8_IS
I'll post this in the flea market too
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Of course not. Why would Canon give up all the free advertising they get just from photographers walking around with those very recognizable white telephoto lenses?
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
If anyone wants dibs on my "original" version (i.e. "mark I":-) let me know..
Is there a particular aspect of the new model that persuades you that it's worth upgrading, or is the expense just not that significant for you?
I could afford the new model if I really wanted to, but if I was going to spend $2000+ on another Canon-brand lens at this point, it would probably be the 14mm f/2.8L II. The old 70-200mm f/2.8 IS is good enough to keep me happy for a long time to come, I think.
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
I like new shiny things :-)
1) extra IS stop
2) better/faster AF
3) better barrel
4) shorter min focusing distance
With 70-200/2.8 IS USM being one of my most used lens, better version makes total sense.
Not to be a jerk, but isn't all that subjective?
1) extra is stop. So starting at 1/200th, to 1/100th, 1/50th. 1/25th for the old version, 1/13th for the new.
Are you really going to be trying for that without a tripod? I would, but would you?
2) better/faster AF. I'd wait for reviews on this, or at least go to a shop with the old version and try them out side by side.
3) better barrel. I didn't read the entire page, but I haven't heard of a lot of these lenses falling apart.
4) shorter MFD. I guess that could help, but it's only 8 inches. instead of being 4' 6'" away you'll be 3' 10".
If they could have made it a macro I think that could be a selling point, ya know, cutting 2 feet of the MFD, but 8 inches, that's only half the length of one of my feet.
I'm guessing that they did their testing on the latest pro body. I wonder if someone using last years camera will reap the rewards promised by this new version.
I'm just getting old and jaded. I hear so much about new and improved, when the rewards are very minimal most of the time.
I hope the new lens is fantastic, and raises your photography to a new level.
Basking in the shadows of yesterday's triumphs'.
I doubt they would advertise it if it wasn't true...
True, but I'd feel better:-)
I agree, it's a minor thing, yet again in my line of shooting sometimes I *really* want to get closer to my model... You know, as they say, "every inch helps"... ;-)
I'm using 5D2 and 7D. When new body comes out, I'll most likely upgrade. Yes, I know it's not 1D series, but those I really can't justify - I don't do sports.
Most of the pictures I'm taking could be taken with Canon 10D and a kit lens. Yet here I am, using latest bodies and L glass, as well as latest computer, latest OS, latest PS, etc.
So, if my pictures suck, I know for sure: it's me, cause I don't have any excuses. Kinda helps keeping me on my toes....
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndexAct&fcategoryid=150
― Edward Weston
This is the only explanation I would ever need!!
What? Ahhh! Man that stinks!
www.tednghiem.com
It reduces choices, but it probably makes sense from Canon's marketing perspective. They had four 70-200 L models, and two of them (f/4 IS and f/2.8 non-IS) were very close together in price. Most likely, they wanted to simplify the lineup into distinct price levels -- f/4 non-IS for people on a tight budget, f/4 IS for people who can spend a little more, and f/2.8 IS for those who can afford the top-of-the-line.
What surprises me, though, is that they haven't already removed the old f/2.8 IS from the list. Maybe they're just waiting to clear out their stock of it, but it's kind of odd seeing I and II versions of the same lens shown as current production items.
Btw, a little more on possible pricing: Someone in the comments on canonrumors.com (I know, not necessarily a reliable source) says that the new Nikon 70-200mm f/2.8 VR is listed by Calumet Germany at 2499 euros, but Calumet US sells the same lens for $2399. If this is correct, then a simple currency conversion between euros and dollars is not useful for estimating American prices for lenses based on European reports. Calumet Germany has the new Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L II IS listed for 2399 Euros. Perhaps we can hope, then, that American street price for this lens will be less than $2399 -- which is about what I expected.
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
I'm with you Dave (though neither old nor jaded
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
www.tednghiem.com
"It's all a dream... only a dream... "
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
www.tednghiem.com
The 2.8 non-IS is back on their page now, $1449.
Nevertheless MP, it's about the market not us!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
― Edward Weston
Okay, well, that takes care of some of our recent speculations. I guess the lesson here is that whenever something changes on Canon's web site, wait 72 hours before you believe it, because they don't have their web act together enough to make changes without making a mess of things.
Got bored with digital and went back to film.
Are you a Canon basher, or do I get the wrong impression from your last several posts here and elsewhere?
Go for it! It's the thought that counts!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
"We" are a component of the market that Canon seeks and fills. If the global market for the new lens "tanks" because of low sales, Canon would no doubt adjust the price accordingly and accept reduced profits.
If the global market accepts the new lens and new price, then Canon has properly read the market and reaps the profit.
The curious thing is that if manufacturer prices get too high, it creates a favorable opportunity for a third-party manufacturer to create a competing product. If Sigma, for instance, wished it could probably create a 70-200mm, f2.8 OS (their version of IS). If they also sell at a better price point and if their quality (image and build) is sufficient, they might capture some of the available market share for 70-200mm, f2.8 stabilized lenses.
It's all a careful game of "guts" and a dance, in which we get to participate with our dollars and "sense".
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Not sure I can. But if I could there are two bodies and two other white lenses that would come first.
Could I borrow your "rose colored glasses" sometime, Ziggy?!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix