Watermark behavior inconsistent.

LA Landscapes · November 12, 2014

Sorry for yet another thread.

I'm having to set my watermarks over and over over. I've gone through my entire site (except the "recent additions" folder and, gallery by gallery, and reset the watermarks. Yet I'm still seeing a lot of erratic behavior.

For instance, and this is just one example:

On my California Landscapes-->Death Valley gallery, I've reset the watermarks via the Organize way and by clicking into the gallery, selecting all, and changing the watermark in Gallery Settings. Still, I'm finding random photos like this one ...

http://www.lalandscapes.com/Outside-la/Death-valleyowens-river-valley/i-bKL3tpT

... where the watermark is displaying an old version.

It's driving me crazy. Can you please tell me why this is happening? Thanks.

annnna8888 · November 12, 2014

Josh, let me explain how watermarking works. If you enable/disable watermarking in gallery settings, this will only apply to FUTURE UPLOADS. It will not watermark/remove watermarks from existing photos in a gallery.

To change the watermark on existing photos in a gallery, go to Organize, select the gallery, select all photos, then click the wrench tool > watermarks, select "apply", select the new watermark, and click "save".

http://help.smugmug.com/customer/portal/articles/93343-watermarking-your-photos

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

LA Landscapes · November 12, 2014

annnna8888 wrote: »

Josh, let me explain how watermarking works. If you enable/disable watermarking in gallery settings, this will only apply to FUTURE UPLOADS. It will not watermark/remove watermarks from existing photos in a gallery.

To change the watermark on existing photos in a gallery, go to Organize, select the gallery, select all photos, then click the wrench tool > watermarks, select "apply", select the new watermark, and click "save".

http://help.smugmug.com/customer/portal/articles/93343-watermarking-your-photos

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

Thanks, Ana. I've done that on every single gallery except the ones in Recent Additions. Including the Death Valley gallery listed in my OP.

annnna8888 · November 12, 2014

Can you please let me know the name of the old watermark that is still showing, and the name of the new watermark that you'd like to apply in the Death Valley gallery?

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

LA Landscapes · November 12, 2014

annnna8888 wrote: »

Can you please let me know the name of the old watermark that is still showing, and the name of the new watermark that you'd like to apply in the Death Valley gallery?

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

I don't know the name of the old watermark it's using. The correct one is CaliFotosNoYear - BottomLeft.

The bigger issue is this is happening all throughout my site, not just on the photo to which I linked and not just in the Death Valley gallery. I don't want to have to click on each photo in each gallery to see if it has the right watermark.

annnna8888 · November 12, 2014

I had a look at the gallery you mention in OP:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Outside-la/Death-valleyowens-river-valley/i-bKL3tpT

This is actually a smart gallery; some of the photos from this gallery are pulled from this gallery:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Recentadditions/Death-valleyfebruary-2013/

Photos in smart galleries pulled from other galleries will always inherit the security settings from the source gallery. In your case, you will need to change the watermark in the source gallery in order for the new watermark to show in the smart gallery, too.

Also, I looked at that gallery in the organizer and changed the watermark on photos that were uploaded directly to this gallery. I selected all photos, then clicked the wrench icon > Watermarks. I selected "apply", selected the correct watermark from the dropdown, and clicked Save - see this screenshot:
http://screencast.com/t/QdzSWcusd

The photos in this gallery that are not pulled from the other gallery should now be watermarked with the watermark you mention.

You should be able to change the watermark in the galleries in the organizer as described above.

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

LA Landscapes · November 12, 2014

annnna8888 wrote: »

I had a look at the gallery you mention in OP:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Outside-la/Death-valleyowens-river-valley/i-bKL3tpT

This is actually a smart gallery; some of the photos from this gallery are pulled from this gallery:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Recentadditions/Death-valleyfebruary-2013/

Photos in smart galleries pulled from other galleries will always inherit the security settings from the source gallery. In your case, you will need to change the watermark in the source gallery in order for the new watermark to show in the smart gallery, too.

Also, I looked at that gallery in the organizer and changed the watermark on photos that were uploaded directly to this gallery. I selected all photos, then clicked the wrench icon > Watermarks. I selected "apply", selected the correct watermark from the dropdown, and clicked Save - see this screenshot:
http://screencast.com/t/QdzSWcusd

The photos in this gallery that are not pulled from the other gallery should now be watermarked with the watermark you mention.

You should be able to change the watermark in the galleries in the organizer as described above.

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

Thanks for figuring that out. I've never expressly (or intentionally) created a smart gallery. Is that created automatically in certain instances?

rnrjosh · November 12, 2014

Smart galleries would only be created if you intentionally specify Smart Gallery rules when creating a gallery. I don't know of any way to have a smart gallery created automatically, as it requires some specific rules to be set so it knows what content to add to the gallery.

WinsomeWorks · November 19, 2014

This is why, as I've suggested again and again, Smart Galleries and any gallery with Virtual images should be clearly marked as such, especially for the owner to instantly see. I'm assuming the OP is in New SmugMug while I'm still in Legacy, but from what I've heard numerous times here, it's the same problem in both. I don't see what the rationale could possibly be for keeping the site owner in the dark, as this affects so many functions, not just watermarking. Please take this to the higher-ups & plead our case-- that we need a large visible statement at top of galleries that are Smart or have Virtual images. And anyone reading this who has feature forum votes left, please go vote for my suggestion here: http://feedback.smugmug.com/forums/17723-smugmug/suggestions/716054-make-it-clear-that-it-s-a-smart-gallery-at-the-top Thanks!!

annnna8888 wrote: »

I had a look at the gallery you mention in OP:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Outside-la/Death-valleyowens-river-valley/i-bKL3tpT

This is actually a smart gallery; some of the photos from this gallery are pulled from this gallery:
http://www.lalandscapes.com/Recentadditions/Death-valleyfebruary-2013/

Photos in smart galleries pulled from other galleries will always inherit the security settings from the source gallery. In your case, you will need to change the watermark in the source gallery in order for the new watermark to show in the smart gallery, too.

Also, I looked at that gallery in the organizer and changed the watermark on photos that were uploaded directly to this gallery. I selected all photos, then clicked the wrench icon > Watermarks. I selected "apply", selected the correct watermark from the dropdown, and clicked Save - see this screenshot:
http://screencast.com/t/QdzSWcusd

The photos in this gallery that are not pulled from the other gallery should now be watermarked with the watermark you mention.

You should be able to change the watermark in the galleries in the organizer as described above.

Ana
SmugMug Support Hero

leftquark · November 19, 2014

WinsomeWorks wrote: »

This is why, as I've suggested again and again, Smart Galleries and any gallery with Virtual images should be clearly marked as such, especially for the owner to instantly see.

...

Please take this to the higher-ups & plead our case-- that we need a large visible statement at top of galleries that are Smart or have Virtual images.

I agree that Smart Galleries / Collected Images could use a better way to distinguish themselves. We also have some inconsistencies that need to be fixed: for example SM Gallery Styles and Journal will display that the photo is "From <original gallery>" but the other gallery styles do not do this. Denise suggested we add this to the Lightbox and I generally agree that it should be there.

We need to do this right, in a way that makes sense for all users. I was surprised to hear how many people don't want any visualization making for these galleries/images. Many users, for example, are concerned that their users will see that it's a Smart Gallery or a collected image. They don't understand that they, as the owner, are the only ones seeing it that way. In Legacy SmugMug we had a "Visitor View" that was confusing for many users. In the New SmugMug we've tried to keep the view for owners and visitors almost identical. We'd like to keep it that way as it makes the site simpler to use/understand.

WinsomeWorks · November 19, 2014

leftquark wrote: »

I agree that Smart Galleries / Collected Images could use a better way to distinguish themselves. We also have some inconsistencies that need to be fixed: for example SM Gallery Styles and Journal will display that the photo is "From <original gallery>" but the other gallery styles do not do this. Denise suggested we add this to the Lightbox and I generally agree that it should be there.

We need to do this right, in a way that makes sense for all users. I was surprised to hear how many people don't want any visualization making for these galleries/images. Many users, for example, are concerned that their users will see that it's a Smart Gallery or a collected image. They don't understand that they, as the owner, are the only ones seeing it that way. In Legacy SmugMug we had a "Visitor View" that was confusing for many users. In the New SmugMug we've tried to keep the view for owners and visitors almost identical. We'd like to keep it that way as it makes the site simpler to use/understand.

I have no idea how something like "Visitor View" could be confusing; perhaps it simply needed a different name like "logged-out view". I used/use it all the time, when available, and was bummed when it became less available. However, the whole thing of trying to keep the view almost identical only panders to those who don't use the site enough to be in dire need of some of these tools, while highly frustrating those who do use it--- multiple times daily. If the only way you guys can solve this is to give site owners a choice of what they want displayed for their own eyes, then so be it. Realize that most of the people using something like Smart Galleries or Hidden Photos or more advanced tools are the ones who get shafted by lack of functionality within those tools. Seriously, not knowing when a photo or gallery is virtual (ESPECially when there are times it shows no link-back!!) is completely crazy-making for those of us trying to use this and therefore to save SmugMug space. (When I didn't have Virtual capability here, I copied lots more photos & duplicated more galleries, using up storage space).

I just think sometimes SmugMug has to think deeper about which group of people are actually frustrated by which decisions & stop trying to protect the minority. The bottom line is, we need to be able to see at a glance what photos / galleries are Virtual. (AND in tool lists or selection-lists of these, which we all know our visitors certainly are not seeing!!) I've screwed up SO many times due to not knowing. How do you think I feel about my ugly invented system? (Placing "C" or "V" for "collected" or "virtual" in my gallery titles so that I don't screw up)? That's right. I hate it; it's ugly, & shouldn't be necessary. If there were a symbol or whatever, & a few hundred people need to go ask "Help" what the symbol is, so be it. That's a fair trade-off to my problem, & is what I feel I'm paying for when I have a Professional-level site.

leftquark · November 19, 2014

Keep in mind that those of you using some of these features and posting here on dgrin are a very small minority of our users. We try to make the site works for the majority of our users. Does that mean I think we're doing it the best that we possibly can right now? No, I think there's a lot of room for improvement and you've touched on many of them. I agree that something can be done to distinguish. We just have to do it right so that it works for all users: both power and normal users.

One thing you could look into is Nicholas Sherlocks SmugMug Extensions for Chrome. It will add visualization to show which images are collected, etc. It may solve many of your needs in the short-term.

WinsomeWorks · November 19, 2014

leftquark wrote: »

Keep in mind that those of you using some of these features and posting here on dgrin are a very small minority of our users. We try to make the site works for the majority of our users. Does that mean I think we're doing it the best that we possibly can right now? No, I think there's a lot of room for improvement and you've touched on many of them. I agree that something can be done to distinguish. We just have to do it right so that it works for all users: both power and normal users.

One thing you could look into is Nicholas Sherlocks SmugMug Extensions for Chrome. It will add visualization to show which images are collected, etc. It may solve many of your needs in the short-term.

I'm in Legacy (until I have any kind of time to work on a new site) and FireFox, so in the interim I doubt that would be of much help, but if I'm desperate at some point, maybe... Meanwhile, here's the thing: Couldn't these improvements at the very least be placed into the tools sections, or any time selections are being made by the site owner only? Surely every site owner knows their visitors can't dig into their tools or certain selection drop-downs unless logged in, so they'd have no worries then about its appearance to their guests. This improvement could be made at the same time a fix comes in for categorizing/identifying galleries in selection lists (such as when we move photos from one gallery to another, & the selection list is one huge long un-alphabetized, un-categorizxed, & unorganized mess). That is the most important instance (in my mind anyway) when we sorely need to know if we're moving to/from a virtual or real gallery!

David_S85 · November 25, 2014

I've been wondering for a while, why my watermarks mostly don't appear on X3 sizes when they appear on X2 and smaller? I have one gallery that seems limited to X2, yet X3 is enabled.

I have over 30 custom watermarks and have used most of them on different photos in that gallery. At X3, I am only seeing the default "PROOF" watermark on most of them.

Thanks!

Wendee · November 26, 2014

David, I can see the difference here,

http://www.davidwattsphotography.com/TraderJoesStore680/TJs-680-2014-Events/43246441_hxc48c#!i=3565124578&k=rxQjx5g&lb=1&s=X2

http://www.davidwattsphotography.com/TraderJoesStore680/TJs-680-2014-Events/43246441_hxc48c#!i=3565124578&k=rxQjx5g&lb=1&s=X3

Could you tell us about the timeline of the gallery; did you enable the X3 view after watermarking the images?

This might be an odd workaround, but in the past sometimes rotating the images one way and then back would set it right for the appropriate watermark to show.

If you continue to have trouble, please let us know.

Take care,
Wendee
SmugMug Support Hero
http://help.smugmug.com/

David_S85 · November 27, 2014

Wendee, thanks for responding.

Yes, I had max gallery display set to X2 when most got watermarked in the lightroom display, then set max gallery display to X3 later. But some were uploaded and then watermarked from the organizer. Would that difference affect the watermarking?

I remember setting the minimum size watermark display a long time ago, but never thought it would make a difference with larger display sizes (nor should it).

I'll try rotating one or two to see if that works. But I'll say that if I have to do that with a hundred photos (twice to get then back upright again), then not only is that a problem for your customers, but is also a bug in SM's code not to be able recognize the display sizing change when a customer decides to change a gallery's settings.

EDIT: Rotating doesn't work to fix them. In fact, rotating removes my custom watermarks and replaces them with the default "PROOF" watermark, so I will not be doing that again. Any other ideas? Do I have to re-watermark the entire set? Most of my photos use different watermarks. I place them in an appropriate area of each photo, so I can't re-watermark all of them again in a big batch.

David

Wendee wrote: »

David, I can see the difference here,
http://www.davidwattsphotography.com/TraderJoesStore680/TJs-680-2014-Events/43246441_hxc48c#!i=3565124578&k=rxQjx5g&lb=1&s=X2
http://www.davidwattsphotography.com/TraderJoesStore680/TJs-680-2014-Events/43246441_hxc48c#!i=3565124578&k=rxQjx5g&lb=1&s=X3
Could you tell us about the timeline of the gallery; did you enable the X3 view after watermarking the images?
This might be an odd workaround, but in the past sometimes rotating the images one way and then back would set it right for the appropriate watermark to show.
If you continue to have trouble, please let us know.
Take care, Wendee
SmugMug Support Hero
http://help.smugmug.com/

Watermark behavior inconsistent.

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