I was wondering if you guys run into a situation I've had happen several times. Not close friends, but acquaintances you have that ask you to photograph them, whether it be family portraits or head shots. Then when you discuss price, you find out their expectation you were going to do them for free.

Does this happen to you all?

Do people not have any shame anymore? I just don't get it. I could understand if they were really close friends but this has happened to me with people I may say hi to a few times at the gym or in the hallway at work. I know that photography is not my full-time job but still, should that matter?

Originally Posted by anonymouscuban I was wondering if you guys run into a situation I've had happen several times. Not close friends, but acquaintances you have that ask you to photograph them, whether it be family portraits or head shots. Then when you discuss price, you find out their expectation you were going to do them for free. Does this happen to you all? Do people not have any shame anymore? I just don't get it. I could understand if they were really close friends but this has happened to me with people I may say hi to a few times at the gym or in the hallway at work. I know that photography is not my full-time job but still, should that matter?

Cuban: Cheap people grow everywhere and the notion of having something for free is like taking candy from a small kid.
WHEN THEY GO TO MCDonalds, even if they know the manager, they have to pay. (Sometimes)
Photography is not your main line of work, but you are very good at it, so, tell them: SORRY, NO TICKET, NO LAUNDRY.!!!!!!!!!!!
JMHO
Carlos

I think unless you make it really clear you're shooting as a pro, people assume you'll do it for free. Human nature, I suspect - this is your hobby, right? ;) I've found the easiest way around it is not pussyfoot about it - just reply with something like "Sure, that would be great! I can email you my prices and availability - let's talk, I'd love to do it!".

Btw, this is also a HUGE problem for singers. You have NO IDEA how many people will assume that singers will happily sing for weddings "for fun". Occasionally you'll get an offer of dinner. The answer? "My fee is $XXX - glad to do it if we can arrange it!". People really do believe that artists/musicians ONLY do it for the joy and satisfaction. Sadly, we have to eat/pay our mortgages just like everybody else.... we are NOT free. We are trained professionals. Would you ask a lawyer to defend you for free?

Btw, I WILL do freebies (both as singer and photographer).... but it's my CHOICE to make that offer, not the other person's to demand it. (eg I have given engagement shoots as a wedding gift to friends, I have sung charity events for no fee etc etc)

/soapbox

ETA: This is also how I have grown my headshots business. Did a few for friends for practice/free (MY choice), started shooting them for money when *I* felt I was ready, and now folks are approaching me. It's not a big business, but I have always made it clear - even to good friends - that I shoot as a *professional*. Word has now got round, and people typically haven't made assumptions.

Enititlement menatality is everwhere nowadays. It's like a parasite or a politician that makes you uncomfortable but that you can't ever really get rid of it.

I only do hobby/TF stuff because I neither need nor want another job. My hobby is for relaxing, not for more stress. I'm also confident (arrogant??) enough to value the fact that I'm a pretty high level amateur. When I'm asked about something like this I basically say that I'm not comfortable shooting anything important for (whoever) and politely decline. (I basically did that for my own sons' wedding and paid for a pro even though my "informal" stuff matched anything they did).

If it's one of possibly three close friends in this world I might do it for free (although these really close friends wouldn't ask, I would volunteer) but other than that, my answer is no and what they think of it is neither my responsibility nor concern.

Yup, used to happen a lot. The biggest problem was when invited to an event, always being asked to bring my camera with me. (this was back in film days so there was always a cost) After having that happen to me for a 50th wedding anniversary party, I came up with a plan.

I invited the couple that have asked me several times to "bring my camera" to particular events to come over to my house for dinner. I also asked if the husband could bring some of his carpentry tools as I had some work I wanted to have done on my deck and figured he could work on it while he was there. They never asked me to bring a camera to anything again.

Yes, I have had it happen several times.
Now I give them a price list and ask them to contact me when they decide on a time & date for the photo session.



Chuck Cassidy,
North Carolina Photos,
www.northcarolinaphotos.smugmug.com

I tell them I have lost the ability to take a casual photo.
The next move is theirs... they either say they were planning to pay me, or they laugh ........and that is the end of it usually.

I do shoot a lot of people at no charge...I practice A LOT to stay sharp and work on new things....as others mentioned almost alway it is me picking someone I would like to shoot not the other way around.

I'm at the point where I've devoted too much time (not spent with my wife) to photographs that haven't been paid for/reimbursed in some way. I still enjoy the shooting, but I have a growing family and at least one other fairly active interest in my life (which is surprising...), so I think I'm at the point where, outside of the closest friends, I will be dropping the free hook-ups for my work friends.

Oh yes, that happens to me as well. My answer is simple " Do you want quality work or just some snapshots ?". If the answer is "quality work" , then I always reply with a price. If the answer is snapshots, I point them to a cheap camera store where they can buy one. After all the equipment is expensive and time is short, so at least there has to be some compensation to cover the cost.
It is also a form of self respect.

This is what I say:

"I would _LOVE_ to take your picture. Let's totally do it. You know me, and you know I don't do anything half way. So in order to make you look awesome I really need to get (that new lens/backdrop/stand|gear rented|whatever). It costs $xxx. I'm a bit short on cash, so if you'll buy it then we can totally do it. Do you have your credit card on you? Let's order it right now! You are going to love these pictures. Should we do overnight shipping so we can do it this weekend? I am so excited! We need to block out at least three hours to do it, what is your schedule like?"

The truth is, I am always excited to spend time with friends. Who doesn't want their friends as customers? I truly want to make them look their best, and I am the person who knows them best and can do that. After the shoot I drop the pics in to a private gallery on SM with marked up prices (with a bit of a discount, they are friends). I go to their house to help them order so I can up-sell them on the pics. Hanging out with friends, or sales call? You decide. I want to be sure they are buying the best prints available. They are going to hang these pictures on their walls and say "Do you know Ryan down the street? He shot these." So I want to make it represent me (and fundamentally them) as best as possible.

When it is all finished they feel like they have a photographer friend who did them a big favor (because they do, and I have). I get at least something for my time. They learn how expensive the gear is, because they bought it. I control the session fee by choosing carefully what to ask for. And I make some cash on the sales to cover some of my post-work time.

This happens a lot!! I agree with Bryce on always needing to bring the camera to events! I have friends that will invite me I purposely leave my camera home and they get mad even if it was not mentioned to bring the camera.

This has been a big issue for me. I'm a physician in a fairly large practice. We have over 100 employees. I take photos at our corporate events and share them freely. Dozens of employees have asked me to shoot photos for them professionally (engagements, headshots, family portraits, weddings, etc...). I initially turned them all down because I felt funny as the "rich doctor" taking money from my employees. I was eventually worn down by one woman who wanted me to shoot her wedding. She argued that she was going to pay someone and she'd rather pay me because she knew I would do a great job. I gave in and now charge my regular rates. Only a few have balked at what I consider to be reasonable prices.

Thanks for the replies guys. I now know I'm not the only one with this problem. I have and will do free work but as others have said, it's with people I'd like to shoot. I approach them, not the other way around. I'm still trying to figure out what I want to do with my photography. I love it. It's a passion and creative release for me. I also know it would be almost impossible for me to replace my income doing it as a fulltime job. Maybe one day, I can semiretire and do photography fulltime.

The thing is that people do approach me to do paid work. It's been nice because I use the money to fund my equipment. It also gives the opportunity to shoot different people and different projects. Technically, I could do a lot of these shoots for free. However, when I consider the investment I'm making in time, equipment, etc., I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to be compensated by someone I truly would not have any interest in photographing otherwise. I guess I'm preaching to the choir though.

The funny thing is that I had a gal approach meat work today to do family portraits for her. After talking with her a bit and establishing what she wants, I gave her my price and we are going to do the shoot on Sunday afternoon at the beach. The great thing is that she is an attractive lady with a very good looking family so it should be a lot of fun to shoot.

Originally Posted by anonymouscuban The funny thing is that I had a gal approach meat work today to do family portraits for her. After talking with her a bit and establishing what she wants, I gave her my price and we are going to do the shoot on Sunday afternoon at the beach. The great thing is that she is an attractive lady with a very good looking family so it should be a lot of fun to shoot.

That's a win/win situation. She going to get some great photos, and you will have the pleasure of photographing her good looking family.

I just had a very attractive employee get engaged. I was hoping she would be interested in some photos since I've always wanted to shoot her. She hired me this week to take her engagement/save the date pics. I'm really looking forward to it.

I personally tend to offer a 'superfriend' discount (e.g., a wedding for a friend would be $500 just to cover basic expenses) and then a smaller acquaintance/friend-of-friend discount, which is something like 20-30% off. So I charge co-workers or other acquaintances, but I do give them a little love since it's someone I know and I'd like them to spread the word. :)

It is a common problem in many fields.

I own an IT company... I hear all the time "Hey can I ask you a quick question about my computer/network/cell phone?".
I have to be blunt. "Sorry.. I avoid technology at all costs when I'm on personal time (maybe throw in a wink).. but if you'd like to schedule an appointment I can have one of my team members get together with you".

The worse is family

I agree that its common in a lot of service type jobs. My best friend does hair, and recently left her salon where she was rental (meaning it was her business, her own prices) to work at a higher end salon where she has no control over prices for the same type of reason, everyone expecting a hookup. I no longer go to her because I literally cannot afford her now but always made it clear that I never expected a hookup from her.


but i feel as photogs it is the same for all of us. I finally went "official" with a site and my prices listed there, because i got sick of everyone that i knew ten years ago but haven't talked to since then asking me on facebook if I would take photos for them. That way I could weed out all the ones who truly wanted *ME* and my talent would still book at my rates, and ones who were looking for a hookup would go elsewhere. Now they can find their way to my site, look at my price and decide if i'm worth the money for them or not.

It does happen a lot. The most simple solution is to hand them a business card and tell them to shoot you an e-mail for a price list. Most people just don't realize you have an actual business.

Originally Posted by sweet caroline It does happen a lot. The most simple solution is to hand them a business card and tell them to shoot you an e-mail for a price list. Most people just don't realize you have an actual business.

Caroline... since posting this, that is exactly what I've done. I actually posted my price list on my site. I didn't have it before. I've been asked twice since this post and both times I handed them a card and said my prices are listed on my site.

Originally Posted by Bryce Wilson Yup, used to happen a lot. The biggest problem was when invited to an event, always being asked to bring my camera with me. (this was back in film days so there was always a cost) After having that happen to me for a 50th wedding anniversary party, I came up with a plan. I invited the couple that have asked me several times to "bring my camera" to particular events to come over to my house for dinner. I also asked if the husband could bring some of his carpentry tools as I had some work I wanted to have done on my deck and figured he could work on it while he was there. They never asked me to bring a camera to anything again.

HA! Awesome!!! I'm going to remember this! LOL