Backup Drives & Software

[Jay_Z]

I would be quite interested to hear what many of you use for backup of your photos and the software for this process.

Currently, I keep nearly everything on an external drive with just some active stuff on my laptop. I need to backup this external drive to another but am looking for some easy software that keeps the files in the native format so I can easily access files if needed.

Working to assemble a good workflow with Lightroom & Adobe PSE combined with my backups and storage. Any feedback on your process/workflow, let me know. Do you have an external drive backed up to another?
Does your Lightroom or Adobe PSE software reference these locations?

[Rhuarc]

http://www.maxoutput.com/FileBack/

Fileback Pro

One of the most customizable backup programs that is available. Seriously, try out the trial version, and you will be amazed by the different things you can do with it.

No, I don't work for them, I am just a very happy customer! LoL

[cmason]

Had a failure once, and the backup software could not restore from the backups, so it was useless.

So now, I keep it extremely simple. I have a main photo drive in my desktop PC. I have a backup drive that is a USB drive (made from an enclosure and a harddrive found on sale). I use software that simply copies any new files to the backup drive, creating a duplicate of my photo folders, and my Lightroom database. No compression, no incremental backups, none of that. Just a simple copy. This way, I always have a copy of the files, with no proprietary format or incremental files. True, I don't get older versions of photos, but with Lightroom, I can not find a reason to go back to any earlier version of a photo in a backup. I can 'undo' to the original in Lightroom. Same for Photoshop as I save as .psd and jpg.

I had a problem with my main photodisk, so I was able to point Lightroom to the backup Lightroom database on the backup harddrive, change the file location in Lightroom and keep working. Once I got my main disk back in working order (go buy Spinrite (http://www.grc.com/sr/spinrite.htm)), I simply copied the backup to the main file, changed things in Lightroom and I was back in business.

I use Microsoft's Synctoy (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/digitalphotography/prophoto/synctoy.mspx), and it runs every evening. I actually have a folder pair for photos, and one for Lightroom database. Any thing that has changed on my photo disk, gets copied to my backup disk. There is also a v2.0 beta if you look around.

Before Synctoy, I used an older, but very effective free program called Karen's Replicator (http://www.karenware.com/powertools/ptreplicator.asp). A few more options than Synctoy, and works great.

Note these are all windows only, and free.

[Art Scott]

I would be quite interested to hear what many of you use for backup of your photos and the software for this process.

Currently, I keep nearly everything on an external drive with just some active stuff on my laptop. I need to backup this external drive to another but am looking for some easy software that keeps the files in the native format so I can easily access files if needed.

Working to assemble a good workflow with Lightroom & Adobe PSE combined with my backups and storage. Any feedback on your process/workflow, let me know. Do you have an external drive backed up to another?
Does your Lightroom or Adobe PSE software reference these locations?

After my first Hdd crash....I decided to do the external route 2 Seagate 500gb Freeagent Pro.....any time I am downloading off card it goes to 320gb WIP (work in progress)drive Also to both of my externals into folder marked as first gen negs and into a dated sub folder........that folder is then moved to 2nd external and overwrites the same on external drive 2 and both those drives have folders that are catagorized as to what type of photos are in them ie: wildlife / nature...land / city scapes etc etc......Once all work is done off the WIP drive then evrything is moved (if I did any PP to file that is) to proper Cat. file on external hdd1 and 2 and all non processed files (already on Cat 1 & 2) are deleted off WIP drive......I also keep a perfect bootable copy of my "C" in a safe...it comes out every week to be totally wiped and to have my "C" drive migrated to it.....now I say weekly....if the only updates I am getting are from AVG or Avast I do not worry about doing a re-migration as thoise will auto update if I need to install my new "C" drive....but I do up date if I add new software or add new Adobe updates and windows updates (especially winders updates) to Keep my back up "C" ready to go.....but since I have the back ups and moved everyting to Seagate Drivs I haven't had any crash scares like I did with WD or Maxtor......................................yet


EDIT:
I mentioned migrating my "C" Drive......this is an exact picture of all files including all the hidden files that Ghost won't move......this software is the only one I have tried and bought due to the fact that all of my software still works after migrating and PSCS wouldn't work properly after Ghosting and after using other utilities to copy the "C" drive......the software is ACRONIS Easy Migrate...........not usre if there is a Mac version and it was only 39.99 download

[Jay_Z]

I should have mentioned - all Windows, no Mac here!

I just got Lightroom and in Adobe PSE I have only used minor PP so far - haven't really tapped into the full capabilities but I am anxious to. Currently, I have a pretty organized filing system of folders but I might use these to organize my library better and be able to access particular images.

As far as the hardware/software for backup - just want an easy streamlined option. One thing I found is that most software provides an incremental/cummulative backup. So, as you make changes to a folder - maybe delete some files or move them, the backup doesn't reflect this - just adds to it. In time, you have a backup which is truly a mess of stuff you've deleted, moved, etc. The only way around this may be doing fresh backups instead of incremental updates to the backup.

Additional hardware configs, workflow, software, ideas greatly welcomed!

[dangin]

I use Microsoft's Synctoy (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/digitalphotography/prophoto/synctoy.mspx), and it runs every evening. I actually have a folder pair for photos, and one for Lightroom database. Any thing that has changed on my photo disk, gets copied to my backup disk. There is also a v2.0 beta if you look around.



+1 for synctoy. it's a great tool! AND it's free.
i use a 1TB WD mybook studio edition external hard drive connected via firewire 800 currently for backups from my main 750GB esata drive. i'll likely be adding 2 more 1TB WD studio drives for this year's weddings. for the capacity, they're not super pricey (~$320) and using synctoy, you can replicate the data from one to another on a regular basis for backup purposes.

[Jay_Z]

+1 for synctoy. it's a great tool! AND it's free.
i use a 1TB WD mybook studio edition external hard drive connected via firewire 800 currently for backups from my main 750GB esata drive. i'll likely be adding 2 more 1TB WD studio drives for this year's weddings. for the capacity, they're not super pricey (~$320) and using synctoy, you can replicate the data from one to another on a regular basis for backup purposes.

I did think about buying a dual drive enclosure and 2 drives (maybe up to 1TB ea) to use as a backup - automatically setting it to backup from one to the other.

[mwgrice]

I did think about buying a dual drive enclosure and 2 drives (maybe up to 1TB ea) to use as a backup - automatically setting it to backup from one to the other.

I bought a DNS-323 from D-Link. It works primarily as a NAS device (network attached storage--you can access your drives through Windows file shares, FTP and a couple other methods). I've been having problems with it since the move, so I'm not sure I can recommend it to anyone else yet.

But I've been using the simple approach for backups, too. The DNS-323 does RAID, but from the research I did it seemed most of the people having trouble with the unit were using RAID. Basically, every now and then I sync up the directories on the two disks with a directory sync utility I found whose name I can't remember. I also sync up an old Windows box I have which also functions as a file server.

The trick to this, by the way, is to either schedule it to run automatically, or to be disciplined to run it often enough to minimize your risks. How often to run your backup jobs will depend on how fast you generate data and how important it is to you.

Anyway, I don't regard the two disks in the DNS-323 as enough. A good jolt of electricity, for instance, could overwhelm my surge protector and fry both disks at the same time. Unfortunately it's not all that unlikely. So I also have an external hard drive which I plug in occasionally to take backups (and I really should do this more often).

Even with both the external drive and the DNS-323, a serious accident in my apartment could toast all of my electronics and destroy all my photos. Fire or water damage from a burst pipe is always a possibility (as are tornados, earthquakes, flooding or hurricanes). So I am also supplementing that (pretty slowly, I have to admit) with DVDs, which will go into an off-site storage locker we're renting.

Off-site network backups aren't a bad idea, either. I rejected it a while ago for a variety of reasons, but I'll probably look at it again in the next couple of months.

[Art Scott]

All my finished work is B.U. at SMUGMUG also........as I look at SM as one of my B.U.'s as well as my porfolio viewer and art store........................

[SloYerRoll]

DROBO (http://www.drobo.com/) drool..

[David_S85]

I would be quite interested to hear what many of you use for backup of your photos and the software for this process.
Currently, I keep nearly everything on an external drive with just some active stuff on my laptop. I need to backup this external drive to another but am looking for some easy software that keeps the files in the native format so I can easily access files if needed.



I just bought a 500GB Buffalo external USB drive and haven't yet plugged it in, so I'm watching this thread closely for software ideas. I only want to replicate and incremently back up the files on my D: data drive. My photos are already backed up on DVD before they even hit my computer on a card burner thingy. But the edited shots are also on D: and need backup along with everything else.

[PhilCollum]

DROBO (http://www.drobo.com/) drool..

:agree Someone made the mistake of telling me about drobo a few weeks ago, and I've been drooling ever sense. But I'd like to here if anyone has any experiences with drobo yet? I'm wary of new stuff until it's time-tested.

[claudermilk]

I think there's some Drobo reviews around here, use the search.

For my backups, I use removable drive trays (effectively externals, but internal when installed) and Acronis TrueImage. Works quite well & restoring is simple. It's set up to deal with even really bad disasters & can run off the original CD if all else fails.

[SloYerRoll]

:agree Someone made the mistake of telling me about drobo a few weeks ago, and I've been drooling ever sense. But I'd like to here if anyone has any experiences with drobo yet? I'm wary of new stuff until it's time-tested.A old design artner from Seattle has one of these. He says it's just as good as the demo video.

I'm having trouble justifying buying one, but I'll eventually do it. The only down side of a drobo is it isn't geographically redundant. So if your home/office burs down, the drobo most likely will go away too. You can back up your data to one drive if it has the capacity I'm sure and keep that in a safe, but how many of us have the discipline to pull the drive out of the safe, run the b/u and put the drive back away? I might do it for a month or so, but then get lazy.. That's just me though..

[dangin]

A old design artner from Seattle has one of these. He says it's just as good as the demo video.

I'm having trouble justifying buying one, but I'll eventually do it. The only down side of a drobo is it isn't geographically redundant. So if your home/office burs down, the drobo most likely will go away too. You can back up your data to one drive if it has the capacity I'm sure and keep that in a safe, but how many of us have the discipline to pull the drive out of the safe, run the b/u and put the drive back away? I might do it for a month or so, but then get lazy.. That's just me though..

i too have been contemplating getting one however the fact that it's usb 2 as opposed to firewire 800 is a real downer and keeps it from being the latest acecessory plugged into my computer. usb 2 is just too slow and inconsistent by comparison to firewire 800, IMO.

[SloYerRoll]

i too have been contemplating getting one however the fact that it's usb 2 as opposed to firewire 800 is a real downer and keeps it from being the latest acecessory plugged into my computer. usb 2 is just too slow and inconsistent by comparison to firewire 800, IMO.Ya, I won't be at all surprised when they release the FW and eSATA versions. If they don't, they are making a pretty big mistake..

[Cuong]

For those who want fire and flood protection for their data, SentrySafe (http://www.sentrysafe.com/products/productDetail.aspx?s=274) has the drive for you. The 160GB capacity is small by today's standards and the price is many times more than a regular drive, but it's probably worth its cost for the protection and peace of mind.

Cuong

[Richard]

I just bought a 500GB Buffalo external USB drive and haven't yet plugged it in, so I'm watching this thread closely for software ideas. I only want to replicate and incremently back up the files on my D: data drive. My photos are already backed up on DVD before they even hit my computer on a card burner thingy. But the edited shots are also on D: and need backup along with everything else.

I have been using SyncBackSE (http://www.2brightsparks.com/) for about 4 months and am really happy with it. There is a freeware version, but for 30 bucks you get the full blown product, which can be configured to do just about anything you can imagine. My daily incrementals to a USB Western Digital drive take about 5 minutes. It can also do full volume and differential backups. On XP Pro or later, it deals properly with open files. Files are not encoded or compressed (unless you want them to be) so you can selectively restore anything you want easily.

But the best thing is that now that I have a real backup system in place, I know that my computer's disk drive will never fail. :D

[SloYerRoll]

Be cautious w/ SyncToy..

I just went to grab a file from my archive HD and discovered while all the directories (folders) were there and everything looked good. THe actual files were missing.

i.e.
I save a file in:
F:\Freelance\......\wcs_nav_graphics\elementarysch oolb.gif

then I run synctoy in Echo mode...

then I go to the same directory on my archive drive and find out the files aren't there. So I go here:
F:\Freelance\......\WCS Nav Graphics\

and it's missing all the graphics files.

I went all over the place and discovered the only thing SyncToy did was create a copy of the file structure, but none of the actual files were saved.

I'm just so happy I didn't have a data disaster and find this out. It would have been very very bad.

Since I know Richard knows more than the average techie in here. I'm gonna jump on board his boat and see how SyncBackSE runs. Seems straight forward and I don't mind paying if I get what I pay for.

HTH

[Richard]

Be cautious w/ SyncToy..


Good grief...why would anyone entrust their system backup to anything that has Toy in its name? :scratch :D

[SloYerRoll]

Good grief...why would anyone entrust their system backup to anything that has Toy in its name? :scratch :DThe really ironic part to me is that it was created for the Microsoft Photography forum as a data backup. :rolleyes

You get what you pay for.

[cmason]

The really ironic part to me is that it was created for the Microsoft Photography forum as a data backup. :rolleyes

You get what you pay for.

Hmm, I have used Synctoy for well over two years, and only recently for photography. My other uses included copying critical files to other PCs in the house as my backup strategy. worked well and all files transfered fine :dunno

[SloYerRoll]

Hmm, I have used Synctoy for well over two years, and only recently for photography. My other uses included copying critical files to other PCs in the house as my backup strategy. worked well and all files transfered fine :dunnoI know it's worked fine for others. But this discover was pretty shocking and I just wanted to make sure anyone else using it did a few "spot checks" on their archived data so nothing terrible happened in the event of data loss.

[joshhuntnm]

I use the oldest system, but it works: the old DOS xcopy command. I have a little batch file on my desktop. double click it and and it saves all the new stuff to a portable hard drive.

I also have one that goes to one of three network drives.

type xcopy /? for details.

[mwgrice]

The really ironic part to me is that it was created for the Microsoft Photography forum as a data backup. :rolleyes

You get what you pay for.

Paying for software is no guarantee that there isn't some horrible bug waiting for you, and higher cost doesn't make it any less likely. I've used too much commercial software to think otherwise.

All software requires a little due diligence. With commercial software, I try to figure out how responsive they are to their customers, how quickly they put out security fixes, etc. With free software, I typically make sure that it's being actively developed, and that users have some way to filing bug reports, getting informal support, etc. I consider access to the source code a good thing, since someone else could at least in theory step in to fix bugs if the developer drops off the face of the earth. It's not always necessary, though (e.g., Adobe seems to support Acrobate Reader reasonably well).

My guess is that synctoy is sort of in limbo. It looks like it's supported informally, but the page was last updated in November of 2006 and I don't think they're doing a lot with it (although I could certainly be wrong). Considering somebody at Microsoft wrote it, I would be very surprised to find the source code available. So I don't think I'd personally use it.

[mwgrice]

I know it's worked fine for others. But this discover was pretty shocking and I just wanted to make sure anyone else using it did a few "spot checks" on their archived data so nothing terrible happened in the event of data loss.

Forgot to mention--this is an excellent idea regardless of the method you use for backups. The time to find out your backups are not working is not the day after your hard drive fails.

And yeah, I'm lazier than I should be about this too...

[Rhuarc]

All my finished work is B.U. at SMUGMUG also........as I look at SM as one of my B.U.'s as well as my porfolio viewer and art store........................

:agree

What I try to do is after each batch of photos I process I go in and make sure that the best of the series are uploaded as full JPG to Smugmug, even if it is in a private gallery. My only wish is that Smugmug would allow RAW files to be uploaded as well.

To get around this I am currently using the service called Mozy. It is an online backup. Costs about $6 a month for unlimited space.

[cmason]

My guess is that synctoy is sort of in limbo. It looks like it's supported informally, but the page was last updated in November of 2006 and I don't think they're doing a lot with it (although I could certainly be wrong). Considering somebody at Microsoft wrote it, I would be very surprised to find the source code available. So I don't think I'd personally use it.

Thats because MS has moved onto Synctoy v2.0 (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=c26efa36-98e0-4ee9-a7c5-98d0592d8c52&displaylang=en). It is in 'beta' which is kinda like a Google 'beta'. BUT that being said, like all other Powertoys from Microsoft, it is technically unsupported by the official MS Technical Support. Other Powertoys likely include many you use now: RAW Image thumbnailer and viewer, TweakUI, Virtual Desktop, etc.

[claudermilk]

I know it's worked fine for others. But this discover was pretty shocking and I just wanted to make sure anyone else using it did a few "spot checks" on their archived data so nothing terrible happened in the event of data loss.

The verification step is an important one that most of us forget. You cannot trust the backup is there until you've done some test backups--then run restores to verify the files were indeed backed up and not corrupted. If we're going to be paranoid with our data, go all the way & make sure these hoops we're jumping through are actually effective.

[Richard]

The verification step is an important one that most of us forget. You cannot trust the backup is there until you've done some test backups--then run restores to verify the files were indeed backed up and not corrupted. If we're going to be paranoid with our data, go all the way & make sure these hoops we're jumping through are actually effective.

One of the things I have seen more than once in the professional IT world is that the backup process has been tested thoroughly, but the restore process has never been attempted till a failure occurs, at which time it fails. Sad, but true.

One of the neat things about SyncBackSE is that you can run simulations of both backup and restore based on the way you have configured it. It then gives you a report of what files would have been moved, but does not actually move them. This is a great tool for fine-tuning the rules you set up without putting your system at risk.

[SloYerRoll]

Ya, I'm diggin SyncBack so far. Looks like they have a customer w/ me. Thanks Richard.

[sanaka]

I run two drives (160GB for now) in RAID1 (simple mirroring) in my computer, and recently got a 500GB Buffalo LinkStation Pro Duo NAS (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822165075) that likewise runs two drives in RAID1. This just has it's own drive letter in Windows. I just periodically copy from my computer photo partition onto the Buffalo using Windows Explorer, and periodically delete off the computer to make space. So, stone simple, nothing automatic, I have to perform the copy when I feel it's time, and there's always two copies of each file, each on its own hard drive. I think uploading to an offsite secure facility would be my next level.

I looked at Drobo but the USB only is lame. When they come out with an NAS it'll be the bizness, though really only a subtle improvement over RAID5, imho.

Peace,
Sanaka

[CatOne]

I looked at Drobo but the USB only is lame. When they come out with an NAS it'll be the bizness, though really only a subtle improvement over RAID5, imho.



Drobo already has a NAS attachment for their enclosure... it's I think $200 more and you plug the Drobo into it. The really nice thing is that the file system is the same... you can direct plug the Drobo to a computer, or you can plug the Drobo into the NAS front-end; no reformatting or anything necessary.

USB only is somewhat lame... but from what I've heard, another interface (Firewire or eSATA) would make it no faster. The unit is internally limited to 20-25 MB/sec, so that being the case, a bus speed that's faster than that won't make a difference. USB2 is "fast enough" for the unit.

I'd like them to optimize their internal interface and then come up with a faster bus speed... I'd be in the Firewire camp.

[SloYerRoll]

Drobo already has a NAS attachment for their enclosure... it's I think $200 more and you plug the Drobo into it. The really nice thing is that the file system is the same... you can direct plug the Drobo to a computer, or you can plug the Drobo into the NAS front-end; no reformatting or anything necessary.

USB only is somewhat lame... but from what I've heard, another interface (Firewire or eSATA) would make it no faster. The unit is internally limited to 20-25 MB/sec, so that being the case, a bus speed that's faster than that won't make a difference. USB2 is "fast enough" for the unit.

I'd like them to optimize their internal interface and then come up with a faster bus speed... I'd be in the Firewire camp.Good knowledge on the bus speed. It's a shame that they haven't considered higher speed needs as being considered standard.

But as you said, USB is only partially lame. I could be off base, but once anyone has all their documents on a DROBO. How many times are they really going to need really lighting fast data transfer?

I'm definately holding out until they re-vamp their architecture or find another JBOD solution.

[sanaka]

The lameness of USB-only to me is not speed but that I want my big storage bank directly networked. I hadn't heard of the NAS attachment, so that's cool! Still worth weighing against RAID5 NAS though.

Peace,
Sanaka

[CatOne]

The lameness of USB-only to me is not speed but that I want my big storage bank directly networked. I hadn't heard of the NAS attachment, so that's cool! Still worth weighing against RAID5 NAS though.

Peace,
Sanaka

Yeah, personally I have an Infrant (now Netgear?) ReadyNAS and it's awesome. Gigabit Ethernet, which I get ~30 MB/sec reads/writes to, I have 2 TB of usable space with 4x750 GB drives... overall it's quite nice. And it supports AFP, SMB, NFS, DAV, HTTPS, etc. Personally I use AFP from my Macs and it's been great in my year of usage so far.