Please critique

[Grumpy_one]

My first black and white

[leaforte]

A very nice juxtaposition. A merry santa, against such a stern look.

[pathfinder]

An interesting image, Grumpy One.

Do you have other alternative renderings in B&W and color? I am not sure that this high contrast rendering is what I might have chosen. How severely was this cropped, or is this the full sized image?

I agree with the comment about strange juxtapositions.

Merry Christmas, indeed!

You might want to consider posting this image in the Whipping Post. It might get more detailed critiques there.

[Grumpy_one]

An interesting image, Grumpy One.

Do you have other alternative renderings in B&W and color? I am not sure that this high contrast rendering is what I might have chosen. How severely was this cropped, or is this the full sized image?

I agree with the comment about strange juxtapositions.

Merry Christmas, indeed!

You might want to consider posting this image in the Whipping Post. It might get more detailed critiques there.

I just thought this was a cool rendering. Here is one that is more conventional. I'm pretty new to this DSLR thing, so I hope you guys understand that right now it's a lot of experimenting. Here is what we are going to print. Unless of course you can give some advice!

[Grumpy_one]

The before. We were waiting to have pic's taken with Santa at the mall (on the Sat before xmas!!, actually wasn't that bad) we found a couch in Macy's and decided to rest, she wasn't feeling good, but had to see Santa non the less. I took some photo's while she was slouching. I thought this would be a good candidate for b/w. And one more thing. I can't believe the difference between what it looks like on the laptop compared to the crt!!! It's a pain.

[Dogdots]

Just curious.....what is strange juxtapositions?

Dogdots/Mary

[leaforte]

Hey Grumpy. I kind of like the original. The red of the hair marries the photo to the santa theme. And the Scottish look of the sash, full circles well. On top of that, you still get that sully feel.

PS: Looking back, your contrasted B/W, the first photo, is quite nice. The Santa twists it, for me, but many times the twist is the photo.

[Grumpy_one]

Just curious.....what is strange juxtapositions?

Dogdots/Mary
In simple terms, juxtapositions is contradiction, or opposing matter. Sully face with a Santa signifying what should be a joyful happy time. My daughter (in the pic) was under the weather that night, but had to see Santa at the mall. We were resting on a display couch when I snapped this one. I also have a b/w with the santa on her face slightly colored. I'll post it later. Happy Holidays.

[Grumpy_one]

Hey Grumpy. I kind of like the original. The red of the hair marries the photo to the santa theme. And the Scottish look of the sash, full circles well. On top of that, you still get that sully feel.

PS: Looking back, your contrasted B/W, the first photo, is quite nice. The Santa twists it, for me, but many times the twist is the photo.
To me, it looks like it's the Santa that is creating the turmoil with her hair. Kinda like ol'man frost blowing the north wind.

[NikonsandVstroms]

Where does the viewer's eyes go....

For me it was from the face to the santa and once you're there the rest of the print seems washed away due to the hard lines and overall boldness of santa compared to the rest of the composition.

Other points:

If you take a step back or so when taking the photo as to not chop the top of her head off it creates more flexibility if you plan to crop (especially if you have MP to burn)

Work on the final cropping, it just seems a little weird cutting her face off at that point, especially when her hair on the bottom could create a interesting boarder for the portrait.

To go on with the hair, it forms almost a boot shape which would be a interesting idea to play around with composition wise (perhaps dodging out her hair above it to highlight this shape as the key element)

Im not sure how to put my feelings about the B&W into words (it looks alot like a photoshop filter in its current form but Im guessing that has alot to do with the jpeg artifacts) but hopefully I can help with your future B&W work by knowing: why did you choose this shot to be your first B&W print?

[Grumpy_one]

Where does the viewer's eyes go....

For me it was from the face to the santa and once you're there the rest of the print seems washed away due to the hard lines and overall boldness of santa compared to the rest of the composition.

Other points:

If you take a step back or so when taking the photo as to not chop the top of her head off it creates more flexibility if you plan to crop (especially if you have MP to burn)

Work on the final cropping, it just seems a little weird cutting her face off at that point, especially when her hair on the bottom could create a interesting boarder for the portrait.

To go on with the hair, it forms almost a boot shape which would be a interesting idea to play around with composition wise (perhaps dodging out her hair above it to highlight this shape as the key element)

Im not sure how to put my feelings about the B&W into words (it looks alot like a photoshop filter in its current form but Im guessing that has alot to do with the jpeg artifacts) but hopefully I can help with your future B&W work by knowing: why did you choose this shot to be your first B&W print?

As far as picking this as my first b/w, I've always been intrigued by faces. This happens to be my daughters. I just thought it would be a good candidate. I had to start somewhere. When you're in sales, you always start with friends and family. I haven't done sales for over 30 years, but it's a good place to start. The more I'm on this board, the more I realize, or it seems to me anyway, that most of you are pro's. I'm just a family guy who loves taking pictures. I'm one of those guys with boxes upon boxes of photo's, some experimental, some good one's. Now that I'm part of this D SLR explosion, I'm running with it. So I hope you pro's don't mind if I get my learning from here. As far as a PS filter, this was done all in LR except maybe some sharpening I did PS. That's a maybe. I do tend to do all my sharpening in PS. Still learning LR. The cropping. It was all about the eyes. That's where my focus went with this one. The Santa is a distraction, but like leaforte said, it's a twist. I even tried to PS it out, too much of a close up. This photo for us was about our daughter that we see everyday. This particular photo caught her in a way that made both of us (mom and dad) go WOW. My wife didn't really like the first one either. I was playing around with all the adjustments in LR and thought it just made her eye's pop. One thing it did was age here. She looks older here. Which is the last thing I need. When asked how old, I always reply 9 going on 19. To me, this is the glimpse of 19. So now that I've rambled, help fine tune my b/w's. I've always liked close up faces in b/w. If I had a gallery, it would be filled of mostly of that and some landscape that you might see later. Thanks

[DavidTO]

I don't care for the conversion. I find it disturbing in an image that doesn't warrant disturbing. Although her stare is kind of icy, I still think the conversion is just too weird. Hair doesn't look like that. The conversion is artificial looking, and in an image that doesn't justify that kind of treatment, IMO.

[Grumpy_one]

I don't care for the conversion. I find it disturbing in an image that doesn't warrant disturbing. Although her stare is kind of icy, I still think the conversion is just too weird. Hair doesn't look like that. The conversion is artificial looking, and in an image that doesn't justify that kind of treatment, IMO.
Ok, so the first one was just an experiment, how about the second b/w? Cropping, tone, composite? Thanks

[Dave Clee]

Well from one amatuer to another here is my take.

The first shot does not work for me at all. Looks like you took the sharpening to far and the hair looks like it has turned into straw.

I do like the eyes even though they convey a bit of sadness. The santa also works for me b/c it gives me the feel that maybe she didnt get to see Santa or is sad about something in xmas. Maybe she is tired of shopping that day..I know I am :) Having 2 kids myself I know that xmas is an emotional rollercoaster. There are some bad times although few and far between and you appear to have captured one of those times.
The lower part of the picture also bothers me as it looks like she is wrapped in hair and for whatever reason it seems to draw my eye everytime I come back to this photo. I would work a few different crops to try and focus on the eyes and Santa. If its B&W conversion you are looking for then do a quick search in the net and you'll find a few good ways to get it done without going over the edge.

As far as the pro thing, well we all arent pros in here thats for sure. But the WP is for your best work only and if its tips on conversion etc etc then there are other forums in here that are better suited to help you out.

Cheers

Dave

[Grumpy_one]

Well from one amatuer to another here is my take.

The first shot does not work for me at all. Looks like you took the sharpening to far and the hair looks like it has turned into straw.

I do like the eyes even though they convey a bit of sadness. The santa also works for me b/c it gives me the feel that maybe she didnt get to see Santa or is sad about something in xmas. Maybe she is tired of shopping that day..I know I am :) Having 2 kids myself I know that xmas is an emotional rollercoaster. There are some bad times although few and far between and you appear to have captured one of those times.
The lower part of the picture also bothers me as it looks like she is wrapped in hair and for whatever reason it seems to draw my eye everytime I come back to this photo. I would work a few different crops to try and focus on the eyes and Santa. If its B&W conversion you are looking for then do a quick search in the net and you'll find a few good ways to get it done without going over the edge.

As far as the pro thing, well we all arent pros in here thats for sure. But the WP is for your best work only and if its tips on conversion etc etc then there are other forums in here that are better suited to help you out.

Cheers

Dave
Tried that, it got moved here from another thread by a mod.