I Know Pitbulls Get A Bad Rap, But....

[imax]

They make one hell of a flyball dog and from what I'm told they make great pets. My wife and I fell in love with this guy. What do you think?

http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16266363-M.jpg

[Andy]

i suppose that there are exceptions to the breed, and that their behavior can be a function of the training they get and their master, i have a problem with pitbulls.

my daughter was mauled by a pitbull at aget 5, she needed over 100 stitches in her face... so, i don't care for the breed.

nice pic though.

[Nir]

Imax, fantastic timing on the shot!


my daughter was mauled by a pitbull at aget 5, she needed over 100 stitches in her face... so, i don't care for the breed.Andy, the 14yo? She's a beautiful young lady! I hate to think of the experience she had to go through, you too!

[fish]

my daughter was mauled by a pitbull at aget 5, she needed over 100 stitches in her face... so, i don't care for the breed.

How horrible! I'll bet that was just terrifying for you and her. While I understand that there are very vocal advocates of pit bulls, I don't like them. There have been several incidents in our neighborhood of maulings and one pet death due to pit bulls. On a personal level, I had a friend when I was in high school who had a female pit bull that was extremely gentle and loving, but I wouldn't want it mad at me.

:soapbox (gee...second time i've used this smilie today)

While the lighting and composition of the shot is solid, I don't like it because I don't like the subject matter. I saw an image on another forum this morning that was a studio shot of a masked man holding a large knife to the throat of a screaming woman. I don't care how technically perfect the image was, I felt the subject matter was unacceptable and violence toward women is a growing problem and should not be made light of.

Here's a snippet of pit bull breed history I found on the net...
Most researchers agree that the Molossus, a large, mastiff-like, war dog, is the ancient ancestor of a number of large breeds. The Molossus seems to have originated in Greece and made its way to Britian via trading ships. The huge war dog also impressed the Romans, who brought them from Britian into other areas of Europe.

From the Molossus descended a variety of dogs, including Mastiffs, Bandogs, Alaunts, and Bulldogs - so named because they were used to catch and hold bulls for the butcher to slaughter. Blood sports, including bull and bear baiting, gained in popularity over time until they became grand events. The Humane Acts of 1835 in England put a stop to bullbaiting, and dog fighting quickly became the new "sport".

[gus]

They killed 2 people here in separate instances so they are 100% banned. I dont like 'em.

[4labs]

Unforunately no matter how caring or conscientious an owner is it's in a pit bulls DNA to snap . If you are into atheltic dogs.. ahem ahem.. there are plenty of other breeds thatare http://4labs.smugmug.com/photos/14073226-S.jpg just as proficient in fly ball but wouldn't hurt a fly..

[gus]

I must add that in saying that..about 1800/year die here in cars & as pedestrians & we dont even give it a 2nd thought during the average day.

[DoctorIt]

talk about opening up the door for bashing!

This is a tough breed. As a lover of dogs and proponent of adoption (often visit shelters), I have a hard saying I don't like any dog, regardless of breed. It is a hard fact that the breed was designed not to be a good "pet". That being said, I have 2 good friends with pitbulls. One of them, Tasha, is the best behaved dog I have ever met. She never needs a leash, all my friend has to do is say "stay", and she'll stay put even when 2 other dogs come flying at her. She's amazing. But then again, she has spent every minute of her life with my friend and he has worked hard with her. The other is a mix with another dog, rescued - Jamie. He's a good guy too, but again, these friends are good with dogs, have rescued several, and know how to train them.

I get mad when I hear about pitbull incidents, because you know that most of the time (i stress most of the time), it's the result of neglect, poor training, or ignorance. Maybe there should be regulations against who can own pitbulls, not necessarily against pitbulls.

anyway, great photo! and back to your regularly sched programming.

[DoctorIt]

Unforunately no matter how caring or conscientious an owner is it's in a pit bulls DNA to snap .Careful now, that's where most people are biased and misinformed. It's not in the DNA to snap. It's in the DNA to be powerful, have an amazingly strong jaw, and for those jaw muscles to freeze up after chomping down.

[fish]

Careful now, that's where most people are biased and misinformed. It's not in the DNA to snap. It's in the DNA to be powerful, have an amazingly strong jaw, and for those jaw muscles to freeze up after chomping down. And aggressive. They're bred to be "war dogs" or "fighting dogs"...your choice.

A little more history (and this is from realpitbull.com):The breed known as the American Pit Bull Terrier was selectively bred specifically with the idea of it becoming the ultimate canine gladiator. But by virtue of the fact that so much of the breed was made up of versatile bulldog blood, the breed also proved adept at a number of non-fighting activities, including those which the bulldog had been used for. Also, the traits bred for in pit dogs were surprisingly ambiguous in their usefulness, specifically the trait of gameness (which was also present in the bulldog). Gameness is defined as the willingness to see a task through to its end, even under penalty of serious injury or death. Gameness was the trait most cherished in a fighting dog for obvious reasons, however this same trait proved useful in other areas--a dog who had the tenacity to hold a wild bull or boar, steadfastness to protect his master's home and property, and extreme tolerance for pain which made for a very stable dog less likely to bite out of fear or pain was terribly useful in rural old England. So while a core group of fanciers focused on the fighting uses of the breed, and bred with the pit in mind, still others kept dogs for bulldoggy tasks.

http://www.badrap.org/rescue/img/vinpitfight1.JPG



From freerepublic.com...


Pregnant Woman Attacked By Pit Bulls

Feb 9, 2005 8:20 am US/Central

Minneapolis (WCCO) A woman fears her unborn baby’s health may be threatened after she was attacked by pit bulls.

Police caught one of the dogs, but now need to find the other to make sure the danger is over.

“I was thinking this is something that only happens in nightmares and movies,” said Maria Riley.

On Saturday morning, Riley decided to go for a walk down Plymouth Avenue in Minneapolis when two pit bulls attacked her.

“They started biting me and hanging on my coat and biting my feet,” Riley recalled.

Riley is six months pregnant and she shielded her unborn child, letting the dogs bite her back and legs. The dogs even ripped off her clothes.

A woman driving by came to Riley’s rescue, by allowing her to jump into the woman’s car.

“If she would have been a minute later…I would have been down,” Riley said.

Animal control and police caught one of the dogs and impounded it. The other dog escaped.

In the four days since the attack, the dog has been spotted several times in the area of Olson Memorial Highway between the edge of downtown and Penn Avenue. The dog is considered a threat to both people and pets.

The Rileys want the dog caught so it can be tested for rabies. Because of her pregnancy, Riley may not be able to get a rabies shot.

“Thank God she is not dead and the baby is not dead and they didn’t get to her throat,” said Nick Riley, Maria Riley’s husband.

The dog that was caught had a microchip because it had apparently been involved in a previous incident. When the owners were contacted, they said they had given away the dog and didn’t know where the current owners live.

Police are investigating.



Then again, maybe I'm just fostering stereotypes. I don't really care. My kids aren't going anywhere near a pit bull if I can help it.

[4labs]

Careful now, that's where most people are biased and misinformed. It's not in the DNA to snap. It's in the DNA to be powerful, have an amazingly strong jaw, and for those jaw muscles to freeze up after chomping down.
You are correct it really is the breeding. Any dog can be bred for temperment .

[mercphoto]

I must add that in saying that..about 1800/year die here in cars & as pedestrians & we dont even give it a 2nd thought during the average day.

Exactly. I don't have a problem with dogs that are properly trained and handled, and I don't have a problem with Pits. Lots of breeds of dogs have bitten, injured, even killed people. I don't see the logic in singling out one large breed over others.

Now, I will admit that some dogs can be dangerous even when happy. My neighbor has a Great Dane. Very well trained, the owner is a stickler for making that dog mind him and behave. But Underdog is so large that even when he is happy, he can knock you over, thus injuring you without any intent whatsoever. Another neighbor's Rottweiler is the same way.

People who own large dogs or aggressive breeds need to be people who will properly train their dogs and do what is necessary to keep them obedient. Sorry, but I blame the owners, not the dogs, when things go wrong.

[gus]

:cry I ride an 1100 cc bike like i stole it & work all day in live power lines 40 feet off the ground ...whats my chances of a dog death ?

[Cosmic]

Just a FYI side note, in a recent study of dog attacks, pitbulls were 4th... from the bottom. Labradors and Retrievers are significantly higher on the list of dog attacks.

It's the owner that shapes the dog.

~Heidi~

ETA: I love the shot btw! lol Great action capture, and the dog is a total cutie! :lust

[imax]

Did not realize that this would open up a big ol can of worms. Sorry Andy about the experience that you and your daughter had to go through. My apologies if the picture brought back those memories.

The reason that I posted this one was that in my opinion it showed the power of the breed as well as the determination. I could have posted any of over 200 pictures

shameless plug http://imax.smugmug.com/Animals

I took this weekend,but I chose this one because of in my opinion, it's beauty. This dog, loved the game. Loved to run, loved to play. He learned the game in just 4 short weeks, while others have trained for months and still do not "play"

As for the composition of this picture, I am curious how it relates to a picture of a man holding a knife to a woman's throat. I could understand if the dog had someone cornered, but the dog is running a course with a tennis ball in his mouth enjoying the game.

Below are some links to read for anyone looking to educate themselves on the breed itself. I'm not looking to change anyone's mind about Pitbulls. The information is there if you care to read it. I merely was stating as a dog lover myself,I own A Bull Mastiff, a decendent of the molossus you referenced, and a Beagle that we fell in love with this particular dog because of his attitude and his beauty.

http://www.pitdogs.org/main/html/history.shtml

http://www.pitbull411.com/history.html

[4labs]

Just a FYI side note, in a recent study of dog attacks, pitbulls were 4th... from the bottom. Labradors and Retrievers are significantly higher on the list of dog attacks.

It's the owner that shapes the dog.

~Heidi~

ETA: I love the shot btw! lol Great action capture, and the dog is a total cutie! :lust Cosmic do you have link to that study . I find it hard to belive and have a study in front of me showing that pit bulls are #1 by large margin. I woudl loive to read the study you are refering to for my own curiosity not to dispute you.. I had no problem with the photo. Just am petrified of the breed from my own experiences

[fish]

Just a FYI side note, in a recent study of dog attacks, pitbulls were 4th... from the bottom. Labradors and Retrievers are significantly higher on the list of dog attacks.
:bs
Got a source?


Pit bulls still have the lead in fatal attacks at 66 mauling deaths between 1979 and 1998 involving at least one pit bull according to the study. Rottweilers were recorded for 37 mauling deaths mostly during the 1990s. German shepherds followed with 17, Huskies at 15, Malamutes at 12, and Doberman pinschers with nine. (http://www.uwsp.edu/psych/dog/LA/Chirichigno1.htm)

[DoctorIt]

:bs
Got a source?


Pit bulls still have the lead in fatal attacks at 66 mauling deaths between 1979 and 1998 involving at least one pit bull according to the study. Rottweilers were recorded for 37 mauling deaths mostly during the 1990s. German shepherds followed with 17, Huskies at 15, Malamutes at 12, and Doberman pinschers with nine. (http://www.uwsp.edu/psych/dog/LA/Chirichigno1.htm)66 deaths in 19 years... I reckon I'm more likely to be abducted by aliens.







:hide

[GREAPER]

66 deaths in 19 years... I reckon I'm more likely to be abducted by aliens.







:hide

I'm bettin the odds are higher if your neighbor, or YOU own a pitbull.

Of course my odds are lower. I dont know anyone that has one, I never see them.

I like it that way. I am a dog lover, always have been.

[fish]

66 deaths in 19 years... I reckon I'm more likely to be abducted by aliens.


Perhaps. But let's just look at ER visits and then tell me how likely it is...

[Steve Cavigliano]

IMAX,

Nice shot :thumb

Although, I have to agree it's how the dog is raised versus genetics. I really am not fond of pitbulls :dunno I live in a city where there are many gangs and gang members. Pitbulls, along with Rotty's and Akitas, seem to be the pets of choice for most of them. They breed them for meanness and stage "dogfights" using these poor animals :cry Every few months you'll see in the local paper where they busted another "dog fighting ring". Or, a "trainer" was caught with scarred and abused dogs.

Also, I've have seen and read too many horror stories about this breed. I witnessed one kill a Harlequin Great Dane and another attack a Mailman (it would not let go of him even after it was hit on the head with a baseball bat :yikes The police, finally, had to wind up shooting it.

Although I don't agree with Cosmic's data, maybe it is due to a pure numbers difference. IOW, since there are so many more Labs and Retrievers, purely by the number of occurances, they may lead the "most likely to bite" list. But as far as which breed is the most likely to bite (and not let go :huh ), on a per capita basis, it's got to be the pitbull.

I remember when I used to walk the dogs with the kids, when they were younger. If we saw a pitbull, we'd load the dogs up, hop into the car and head home. Whether we had just got there, or were only 1/2 way through the walk, or whatever. It just wasn't worth the risk. As mentioned, there are some good ones that have been raised properly. But, for the most part, these dogs should not be around people, IMHO. Just as Wolf pups are really cute and playful, but can go "psycho" when they reach adulthood.


Just my opinion,
Steve

[Cosmic]

Don't get me wrong. I love Labs! My 3 year old Jetta is part Great Dane, part Lab. She's as sweet as pie!

I can't find the original article where I read about dog breed bite specifics, but I found a couple more...

http://www.goodpooch.com/bsl.htm#banlabs

"According to statistics kept by city of Boulder Animal Care and Control, "labs" — as they are so innocently called — were responsible for an astonishing 18.9 percent of the 748 dog bites in the city from 1997 to 2003, more than twice as many as the next highest breed (German shepherds, at 8.5 percent)."

"There's no way to really identify all the breeds that could pose a danger," he says. "The ban on breeds is a very simplistic and knee-jerk reaction to a much more complicated problem. A breed ban only takes care of 10% of the problem. The other 90%—training, socialization, health of dog, the victim's behavior—a breed ban doesn't address those issues."

- Esteemed Veterinary professionals have stated that it is impossible to correctly identify the breed of a dog, without knowing its breeding origin. Not even through DNA testing can this information be identified. Very few individuals are qualified to make an educated guess, and this very rarely includes Veterinarians because generally, they do not specialize in specific breeds. Police Officers have absolutely no qualifications necessary to identify dog breeds, and have mistaken breeds such as the Jack Russell Terrier, calling them Pit Bulls during investigations of dog injuries. More information on the innacuracy of identifying breeds can be found at:

http://www.goodpooch.com/MediaBriefs/GPpitbulls.htm


For your own amusement, see how quickly you can identify the Pit Bull image located on this page:
http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/findpit.html

I wish I could find the original article I had read. I'm still searching. It was an article from Health Statistics Canada posted on a forum I frequent.

~Heidi~

[Khaos]

Just a FYI side note, in a recent study of dog attacks, pitbulls were 4th... from the bottom. Labradors and Retrievers are significantly higher on the list of dog attacks.

It's the owner that shapes the dog.

~Heidi~

ETA: I love the shot btw! lol Great action capture, and the dog is a total cutie! :lust
Yes, but what are the difference in numbers of ownership? The more there is of one type, the larger the increase in numbers of an event. The percentage based on attacks compared to the number of the breed is a better indicator.

Do you have a link to this data?

[Cosmic]

I just posted some links above.

As I was browsing for good sources (trust me I'm leery when it comes to info on the net), I also came accross quite a few sites that said Pitbulls were the #1 dog breed in America.

[Andy]

Perhaps. But let's just look at ER visits and then tell me how likely it is...

actually bagels (www.welcoa.org/freeresources/ pdf/welcoa_dancing_doctor.pdf) are one of the major reasons for jump in er visits on saturday and sunday mornings. oh and here's one cure (http://www.larien.com/biter.html)

[Charlie Brown]

ok so im going to go ahead and weigh in here. i work as a vet tech, ive been doing it for about 5.5 years. im bitten alot, ive been to the emergency room twice this month alone. ive never been bitten by a pit bull, yes they can be agressive. yes they can be raised and trained to be agressive and what some call actively protective. for my money id like to see pitts all day long, all day every day and twice on sunday. chows on the other hand, well i like to say the only good chow is a dead chow. labs bite alot of people, more than you would believe, as do goldens. we get calls daily of people pets biting them or their children, and they generally say well hes a lab...its not like hes a pitbull or anything. oh and if you think agressive pits are bad, you should deal with a presa canario or a fila brasila or a cane corso or any other number of breeds. for the most part all the "bad" breeds that i see are gentle and freindly, sure i dont get the drug dealers fighting dogs in all the time, but thats not apples to apples is it? are we to also say that guns, knives, poisons, clubs, fatty foods, drugs, cigarettes and cars should be banned as well?



cb

[wxwax]

The reason that I posted this one was that in my opinion it showed the power of the breed as well as the determination.


Hmmph. If you wanted to show power, you should have posted this photo. (http://imax.smugmug.com/gallery/404924/6/16266294)

So Imax, how's it feel to have your thread hopelessly hijacked? :lol3

[Angelo]

Heck even trained tigers will inflict life threatening bites, just ask Roy!

[imax]

[QUOTE=wxwax]Hmmph. If you wanted to show power, you should have posted this photo. (http://imax.smugmug.com/gallery/404924/6/16266294)

How's This For Power?

http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16375170-M.jpg

or how about this?

http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16375163-M.jpg



Or The Power Of Suggestion, Hungry Anyone?



http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16375169-M.jpg

[Shakey]

This thread Bites.:bad :lol4 :lolCan it be put down?:rofl :D

[gubbs]

This thread Bites.:bad :lol4 :lolCan it be put down?:rofl :D Any respect you earnt from the beer post has now gone! :rolleyes

[Bodwick]

This thread Bites.:bad :lol4 :lolCan it be put down?:rofl :D

What about a hyena as a choice for the kids to play with.....
You can be sure that any local gang members with a pitbull won't mess with you....

West African Security...(Not my photo, but it seemed like a good time to post it)

[gus]

What about a hyena as a choice for the kids to play with.....
You can be sure that any local gang members with a pitbull won't mess with you....

West African Security...(Not my photo, but it seemed like a good time to post it)
I went looking for that shot at the start. Imagine the smell ?

[Dani]

ok so im going to go ahead and weigh in here. i work as a vet tech, ive been doing it for about 5.5 years. im bitten alot, ive been to the emergency room twice this month alone. ive never been bitten by a pit bull, yes they can be agressive. yes they can be raised and trained to be agressive and what some call actively protective. for my money id like to see pitts all day long, all day every day and twice on sunday. chows on the other hand, well i like to say the only good chow is a dead chow. labs bite alot of people, more than you would believe, as do goldens. we get calls daily of people pets biting them or their children, and they generally say well hes a lab...its not like hes a pitbull or anything. oh and if you think agressive pits are bad, you should deal with a presa canario or a fila brasila or a cane corso or any other number of breeds. for the most part all the "bad" breeds that i see are gentle and freindly, sure i dont get the drug dealers fighting dogs in all the time, but thats not apples to apples is it? are we to also say that guns, knives, poisons, clubs, fatty foods, drugs, cigarettes and cars should be banned as well?



cb

not to mention JACK RUSSELLS!!! We've got one... and it'd be quicker to bite or kill than any pit I've ever met. I've got the scars to prove it too. I can't count the number of times that little dog has gone for my face or throat, or gone after small children and babies, or tried to kill other pets. Its a psychotic animal and needs to be put down before it seriously hurts someone... but mom refuses to listen...

I also think alot of breeds get confused as pits... breeds such as the dogo or cane corso etc.

[Angelo]

This thread Bites.:bad :lol4 :lolCan it be put down?:rofl :D
yes please!!! :deadhorse

[gus]

Anyone ever walked into a house yard with an Australian Blue Heeler ?

Jesus talk about savage. I drive into remote house areas most of the day looking for power problems & I will generally get out of the truck & front any dog but a blue heeler....not a chance. If the owner isnt there then i leave. It was the dog on mad max (road warrior)

[Dani]

Anyone ever walked into a house yard with an Australian Blue Heeler ?

Jesus talk about savage. I drive into remote house areas most of the day looking for power problems & I will generally get out of the truck & front any dog but a blue heeler....not a chance. If the owner isnt there then i leave. It was the dog on mad max (road warrior)
yup! friend had one... was the sweetest dog until it got into the back bed of his truck... then she turned into viscous killer. Doesn't matter if you were hugging all over her 2 seconds before.

[4labs]

It's amazing people post wonderful pictures and barely get a response but this thread gets so much attention(I am as guilty as the next person)I say more dog photos:clap

[gus]

yup! friend had one... was the sweetest dog until it got into the back bed of his truck... then she turned into viscous killer. Doesn't matter if you were hugging all over her 2 seconds before.
I have been bitten on the arm lane splitting on my bike by one in the back of a ute. Apparently i was to close to the boss's stuff & she decided to get me.

You should see them on snakes....like a lawn trimmer hitting a bowl of spagetti :rofl

[fish]

It's amazing people post wonderful pictures and barely get a response but this thread gets so much attention(I am as guilty as the next person)I say more dog photos:clap

38 replies, 429 views. imax should be quite pleased that his image caused such a stir. Content matters.

[wxwax]

II say more dog photos:clap


It's 4labs fault - he made me post this. :evil

I was trying my panning technique on a very happy dog in the park yesterday.

http://wxwax.smugmug.com/photos/16427882-L.jpg

[4labs]

It's 4labs fault - he made me post this. :evil

I was trying my panning technique on a very happy dog in the park yesterday.
The practice is paying off...http://4labs.smugmug.com/photos/12492519-S.jpg

As Andy would say "Enjoy dog photography" lol

[Photosbychuck]

They make one hell of a flyball dog and from what I'm told they make great pets. My wife and I fell in love with this guy. What do you think?

http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16266363-M.jpgGreat photo! :thumb
Keep up the good work.

Take Care,
Chuck,
Photo's by Chuck: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/photosbychuck

[Mongrel]

it's a pity that an extremely innocous picture, well composed, great exposure and color, sharp as a tack, posted on a photography forum turns into a 'discussion' on dog breeds.

Get real-this IS NOT a shot of a menacing dog, not in any way shape or form.

Funny, I was hit in the eye by a baseball as a child, maybe I should post my *subjective* feelings on flying leather when someone posts a shot of a kid playing baseball...

My uncle was run over and killed in a cross walk by a drunk guy driving a pickup truck. Maybe I should cry and pee my pants when someone posts a shot of a truck, or how about all those little Guiness smilies and shots of booze bottles?

Oh, and those portraits of *children*? Don't you realize the amount of violence people under the age of 18 inflict on society? Please don't post them, I get chills just thinking about it.

I realize I'm a newbie here, but this thread is embarassing and I think that Imax is owed a pretty big community apology for the disrespect he was shown.

Very nice shot Imax, I like it a lot. I can see why you and your wife could fall in love with a dog with that kind of intensity.

Take care, and happy shooting!

They make one hell of a flyball dog and from what I'm told they make great pets. My wife and I fell in love with this guy. What do you think?

http://imax.smugmug.com/photos/16266363-M.jpg

[gus]

Not for me...as fish once put it.

A 'good ' photograph causes emotion & controversy to run wild. Anything else is a photograph.